CAP 2 Smogon "Create a Pokemon" Part Deux: Discussion 8

[Instinctive]

To see the moves I removed, scroll to the bottom of this post. They are all listed with reasoning.




Level Up Moves:
1. Wrap
1. Bind
1. Bide
2. Sand Attack
3. Sand Tomb
7. Imprison
10. Arm Thrust
14. Scary Face
18. Mean Look
24. Ancient Power (possible evolution method)
25. Shadow Punch
32. Revenge
41. Icy Wind
48. Power Whip
53. Hammer Arm
63. Moon Light
67. Earth Power
80. Aura Sphere

Egg Moves:
Ice Punch
ThunderPunch
Shadow Sneak
Mach Punch
Memento
Spite
Curse
Grudge
Destiny Bond
Pursuit
Punishment
Ominous Wind
Knock Off
Night Shade
Nasty Plot


TMs:
1. Focus Punch
6. Toxic
8. Bulk Up
10. Hidden Power
11. Sunny Day
12. Taunt
15. Hyper Beam
17. Protect
19. Giga Drain
20. Safeguard
21. Frustration
26. Earthquake
27. Return
30. Shadow Ball
31. Brick Break
32. Double Team
36. Sludge Bomb
37. Sandstorm
43. Secret Power
44. Rest
48. Skill Swap
52. Focus Blast
56. Fling
60. Drain Punch
61. Will-o-Wisp
63. Embargo
66. Payback
68. Giga Impact
77. Psych Up
79. Dark Pulse
80. Rock Slide
82. Sleep Talk
84. Poison Jab
87. Swagger
90. Substitute
HM04. Strength
HM06. Rock Smash





86. Grass Knot (if it gets Power Whip it gets this)
WHY? I think we drop this, it has no significance for flavor, nor competitive use.

HM08. Rock Climb
While it kinda makes sense, it seems to be just another move we slapped on. Lets drop it.

67. Recycle
Why would a mummy recycle? I think this move ha sno competitive use in addition to not fitting thematically.

58. Endure
Is there a reason we have Endure? I think it should be dropped from all lists, unless somebody can tell me why it should stay.

28. Dig
Doe sit need Dig? Is there a reason it gets dig? What is it going to dig with?

5. Roar
How is it going to Roar? HOW?????

Rock Tomb
As thematic as it is, I think we can drop it because the mummy can use Sand Tomb. One tomb move is enough.

Bone Rush
If Lucario is the best reason to be had for Bone Rush, we should drop it. Luke is a dog, and relatively quick. Our mummy probably qon't be rushing anything...

21. Glare
Has anybody noticed that only the snake pokes get Glare? The Japanese translation must be different, so maybe we don't give it to this guy...

59. Hypnosis
59. Nightmare
85. Dream Eater
We are beginning to give him too many options on a stretch here. Why would a mummy hypnotize something?

73. Shadow Ball
I think we drop it off of level up but keep the TM option, just to trim the list down a bit.

Fire Punch
Obviously up for debate, but since we need to trim it down, Fire should go first.

36. Hyper Voice
It can't yell....drop this move please.


Othe rmoves it could probably drop are Bide, Memento, Nasty Plot, Destiny Bond, and Ominous Wind.

I think the punches should go to Heart Scale also, in case that wasn't already the idea.

 

[NatKing]

Mummies can't yell or roar?

Have you ever seen a redead(zelda), son?

 

[1059860]

You can't possibly be serious adding the Elemental Punches onto this thing...

A tank with Swampert-like stats, having no 4x weaknesses, with Moonlight, can only be countered with Psychic/Flying types. Psychic types get pwned by its STAB-Ghost moves such as Shadow Punch/Sneak. Now you have Flying counters left...

A Swampert-Tanky Pokemon, who has Moonlight to heal, no 4x weakness, and Shed Skin to shake off Toxic or other status, with only 1 EFFECTIVE counter type (Flying), now has ThunderPunch and Ice Punch????!!!!

The only counters I can think of right now that would effectively counter this thing are Togekiss and Skarmory. And having 2 out of (493 + Syclant) Pokemon is OVERCENTRALIZING the game...

I'm just making my point of why this thing must not have Ice Punch and ThunderPunch, or else get rid of Moonlight (which is by far the distinct winner right now over no-nonRest-healing-moves).

 

[Luck]

Mummies can't yell or roar?

Have you ever seen a redead(zelda), son?

The Mummies in the movie "The Mummy" scream quite a bit too but this poke does need roar or hyper voice

 

[Screw-On Head]

Mummies can't yell or roar?

Have you ever seen a redead(zelda), son?

This is a Pokemon without a mouth. Pokemon without mouths can't Roar, and only particularly noisy Pokemon with mouths learn Hypervoice. This Pokemon is neither particularly noisy nor has a mouth. No Hypervoice. No Roar.

 

[AJC]

you do know that moonlight and the other 2 weather dependant recovery clones ARE limited to 5/8 PP max making them not really great for stalling

 

[Mario With Lasers]

Lol, I just realized Moonlight will always recovers 50% HP if the mummy's trait is Air Lock.

EDIT: Now, which changes would I make to the movepool:

Bind - Go away.
Rock Tomb - Why two tomb attacks? I'd ditch this one.
Hyper Voice Errm, where is the mouth.
Hypnosis - No. Dusknoir is arleady getting owned by this thing, Hypnosis is just too good for it.
Shadow Ball - But it's a TM >_>
Punishment - Doesn't really fit it, IMO. Doesn't it have too much "flavor" moves?
Knock Off - Too sexy for his shirt.
Roar - Errm, where is the mouth again.
Drain Punch - Even though it's a sucky move, this thing already gets Moonlight and Brick Break.
Recycle - No need.
Curse - Could be a Level-up move.
Icy Wind - Hyra said already there are counters that aren't stopped by it, but... Desert. Arid place. It might be a tomb, but Icy Wind? More like Ominous Wind.
Nasty Plot - I suggested it and don't like it anymore. I mean, with some EVs here and there, we could even make it a mixed sweeper, what the hell...
Will-O-Wisp, Fire Punch, Thunderpunch - That's not a vote because I did it already, but still, no.

So, we get...

Level Up Moves:
1. Wrap
1. Endure
1. Bide
1. Ice Punch (and other Elemental Punches?)
3. Sand Attack
3. Sand Tomb
7. Imprison
10. Arm Thrust
14. Scary Face
18. Mean Look
21. Glare
24. Ancient Power (possible evolution method)
24. Shadow Punch
28. Curse
32. Revenge
37. Nightmare
42. Hammer Arm/Cross Chop/Dynamic Punch/Close Combat/Super Power (aka main Fighting STAB move)
46. Power Whip
51. Earth Power
55. Aura Sphere
59. Moon Light

Egg Moves:
[Not anything new]

TMs:
[Not anything new]

Total: 73 moves.

That's considering only one STAB move at level 53, only Ice Punch as the Elemental Punch, and no WoW.

 

[Hyra]

Hey guys, this isn't post your learn sets. That was for earlier, before this thread. You can post changes you would like to see, but reposting the list just adds unnecessary page stretch.

Anyways, X-Act PM'd me a restricted movepool which I really like. I'm going to take his with a few changes and edit it into the main post. Along with the reasoning behind the moves, thematically.

And to those complaining about a large movepool, I posted just about every option and left it up to you guys to complain about what you want removed. It's more likely that you'll see something you dislike then notice something you want is missing.

 

[DougJustDoug]

And to those complaining about a large movepool, I posted just about every option and left it up to you guys to complain about what you want removed. It's more likely that you'll see something you dislike then notice something you want is missing.

I know you are posting all the possibilities, and I agree with it. My post was more to encourage that we drop lots of stuff off to create a small overall movepool. I didn't mean to imply that your OP was advocating a massive pool.

 

[Bull of Heaven]

Those of you wanting Ice Punch and Thunderpunch, remember that one of the main selling points for a Ghost/Fighting pokemon was that it would be countered by Fliers. Remember the essay by futuresuperstar (I think) about why the type would not necessarily be broken? This is why I said "Fire Punch only" in my first post.

 

[Hyra]

Okay, OP is updated. I also added another question. Hypnosis is powerful enough that I want a vote on it. Egg Move List is a little big right now, but I'm not sure what to remove. On the TM List, I guess the Poison Moves can go, but there aren't that many moves besides Roar (which it is keeping because it is a Gibdo at heart) to remove.

 

[darkie]

I don't like Hypnosis on this. While it would have use competitively, I feel it would be a bit overpowered. If you remove the three sleep moves from level-up, you can move some egg moves to those three slots.

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

Do Gibdos even make any noises despite the no mouth thing?

No Hypnosis, Nightmare, and Dream Eater. When did Mummies hypnotized people?

 

[Hyra]

Do Gibdos even make any noises despite the no mouth thing?

No Hypnosis and it's bed friends. When did Mummies hypnotized people?

They yell and eat you. One of the reasons no one likes playing in dugneons with them, because they come screaming out of nowhere and then deal massive damage.

 

[Dane]

Like I said before, I'm against Hypnosis on this. Thematically makes no sense, maybe on a vampyre but not a mummy. Plus it's a little too strong on a tank in my opinion.

And I see you have Fire Punch listed as a move, which I'm also adamantly against.

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

They yell and eat you. One of the reasons no one likes playing in dugneons with them, because they come screaming out of nowhere and then deal massive damage.

Yikes. I originally never heard of a Gibdo nor never heard one scream and beside I only thought the redead are the ones that scream.

 

[DougJustDoug]

I don't think it should get Hypnosis. I don't know if Yawn is even an option, but I think Yawn makes sense conceptually with the sleeping mummy theme.

 

[Time Mage]

Regarding the last question:


*NEW*
Does this get Hypnosis and associated moves?

-No: I think that with Glare, Knock Off, Toxic, Taunt and others, the disabling move list is good enough. For example, Glare is the normal equivalent to Stun Spore, so despite the low accuracy it'll be handy against the grounders.

 

[Instinctive]

No Hypnosis and related moves


Also, WHY on earth is it getting ROAR????????????????????????


IT HAS NO MOUTH!

 

[Rhykune]

IT HAS NO MOUTH!

How do you know??? It is wrapped in bandages. It could be a streched/muffified/reshaped Exploud for all we know.

 

[Instinctive]

So it will roar at you throught the constrictive bandages?

 

[Darkflagrance]

It is a Ghost Pokemon, not an actual living thing wrapped up in bandages. There probably isn't actually anything underneath the wrappings except ectoplasm and dark vapors.

Level Up Moves:
1. Wrap
1. Bide
3. Sand Tomb
7. Rock Tomb
10. Imprison
14. Arm Thrust
18. Mean Look
21. Glare
24. AncientPower (possible evolution method)
28. Shadow Punch
32. Revenge
36. Power Whip
45. Fighting STAB
52. Hypnosis
52. Nightmare
52. Dream Eater
60. Moonlight

I like this set of level-up moves. However, I disagree with the punches.

I think everything on the TM/HM list is fine. Let others nitpick at that.

What should the main Fighting STAB move be??
-Close Combat
-Cross Chop
-Dynamic Punch
-Hammer Arm
-Super Power

The problem with Close Combat is that it goes against the pokemon's defensive nature. If it could have more than one "main fighting move" on this list I would include it, but otherwise I prefer Superpower.

Which, if any, of the Elemental Punches does this get??
-Fire Punch
-Ice Punch
-ThunderPunch
-None

I disagree with all the punches here - Ice and Thunder because they hit flying types and Fire because dry wrapped mummies shouldn't be playing with fire. It's like an Ice-type learning Fire Blast.

Does this get Recovery outside of Rest??
-Yes, move is Moonlight (fits better with a vengeful mummy than Morning Sun)
-No

It has Airlock now...at least Moonlight has low PP...besides, if it is broken we can remove it.

Does this get Will-o-Wisp??
-Yes
-No

*NEW*
Does this get Hypnosis and associated moves?
-Yes
-No

 

[Rhykune]

What is ectoplasm? And you have a point about the constrictive bandages... Maybe it has a tourtured soul left in it which screams?

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

What is ectoplasm? And you have a point about the constrictive bandages... Maybe it has a tourtured soul left in it which screams?

Mummymon: Yes...I'm just fulled with ectoplasm and nothing else =D

 

[Screw-On Head]

How do you know??? It is wrapped in bandages. It could be a streched/muffified/reshaped Exploud for all we know.

Because WE made it, and it is OUR Pokemon (meaning the community), WE can decide what it does or doesn't have. I see it like this: as a Pokemon, the bandages are part of it's "skin" so, no, it doesn't have a mouth. This guy is heralded by an eerie silence, rather than an a howl and a roar. No sound moves, ever.

Does this get Hypnosis and associated moves?
NO!

Also, No Power Whip/Giga Drain/Grass Knot. Deserts are, by definition, not grassy.