CAP 4 CAP 4 - Attacking Moves Discussion

[Yamaha]

We can't change his ability, we already voted on it.

Oh Yeah. Vital Spirit.

Well Thick mud doesn't sound like a move name.



Mr. Daddy long legs switched in!
Jolteon used thunderbolt!
It didn't effect Mr. Daddy long legs.

Mr. Daddy long legs did Thick mud!
The ground thickens with moisture!
Jolteon used Hidden power!

Mr. Daddy long legs lost 68% of its health.
It was super effective.

Mr. Daddy long legs used Earthquake!
Jolteon lost 186% of its health.
Jolteon fainted.

Thick mud works to cut the foe's speed in half for 5 turns
(7 turns with Persistant)

But I don't know if Thick mud for a name would fit. :O

 

[tennisace]

Oh Yeah. Vital Spirit.

Well Thick mud doesn't sound like a move name.



Mr. Daddy long legs switched in!
Jolteon used thunderbolt!
It didn't effect Mr. Daddy long legs.

Mr. Daddy long legs did Thick mud!
The ground thickens with moisture!
Jolteon used Hidden power!

Mr. Daddy long legs lost 68% of its health.
It was super effective.

Mr. Daddy long legs used Earthquake!
Jolteon lost 186% of its health.
Jolteon fainted.

Thick mud works to cut the foe's speed in half for 5 turns
(7 turns with Persistant)

But I don't know if Thick mud for a name would fit. :O

Thats not an attack move, and really, it doesn't fit.

 

[X_Presumptuous]

If we get Thick Mud, I think it would work better to switch its place with the current TailWind in the Persistent ability. And making it 7 turns is really really broken. As in OMGWTFBBQPLZ broken.

I kinda still like that ballooning spiderling Tailwind pre-evo idea more, though. I thought it brought out DLL's spidery background. ;[

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

I like the pre-evo/tailwind explanation more too, but Thick Mud/Quick Sand/whatever is a good alternative as well lol.

Back to the topic at hand, anyone took the time to make a list of debatable or accepted moves for this guy? I would be but mother nature seem to hate Maryland at the moment :c

Edit: Scratch that, Tennis is right. Too many debatable moves to list O_o

 

[tennisace]

I'll make a list of debatable things I guess, but its really Sunday's job.

Edit: I really can't make the list since there's too much up for debate, imma leave this to Sunday

 

[Yamaha]

Absolutely Yes:
Arm Thrust - Hands
Baton Pass - It's a Support pokemon also because it gets wish too. :D
Bullet Punch - He got hands and the speed to pull off one.
Comet Punch - Meh.
Dig - Ground type
Dizzy Punch - Hands
Double Slap - Hands
Earthquake - Ground type
Earth Power - Ground type
Fake-Out - Hands
Fire Punch - To get advantages of his Base attack
Focus Blast - DLL has holes in it hands, It will Launch off one. :D
Focus Punch - Blissey Counter perhaps?
Force Palm - Hands
Gunk Shot - Poison type and 75% accuracy get its advantages of not being broken.
Gravity - Persistant
Ice Punch - LOL GARCHOMP U LOSE.
Mach punch - Hands and to Ohko Weavile. :O
Mega Punch - Hands
Mud Bomb - Ground type
Mud Shot - Ground type
Mud Slap - Ground type
Poison Jab - Poison type
Rapid spin - Mr. T has one, and so Forry too. So why not another effective spinner?
Sludge bomb - Poison type
Sucker Punch - Counter to Deoxys-e, perhaps?
Taunt - Hands
Thunderpunch - Hands.
Tickle - Hands
U-turn - Hey This is like Jirachi's Set. Wish/U-turn
Wish - Above ^^

Maybe:
Counter - To be like Wobbuffet. :D
Drain Punch - for Leftovers recovery and power.
Flail - Lol
Gyro Ball - High speed, Low attack base - It's just for in-game
Icy Wind - Yeah, not so flavor-wise.
Needle Arm - Hands
Power Gem - His "Gem" on its head.
Psychic - Same as above ^^
Seismic Toss - Toss it up and down for 100 Damage. :D
Shadow Punch - It works.
Shadow ball - It works from it holes from it hands.
Tri-Attack - To make use of 30% Hax and his nice Sp. Attack base
Charge Beam - To Increase its sp. Attack.
Close Combat - Bye Blissey after I hit you again.
Cross Chop - Same as above ^^
Energy Ball - Bye Swampert.
Flamethrower - LOL FORRY, No Good bye.
Ice Beam - Do I have to say this one?
Stone Edge - It works.

Absolutely No:
Explosion - Too Powerful and not flavor-wise
Fire blast - Too Powerful enough.
Thunderbolt - We don't need a 100% Gyarados counter.
Charge beam and T-punch are enough to 2ohko.
Dark Pulse - Doesn't work.
Any Water attacks - It doesn't work for a spider.
Any Flying moves - What the Hell. DLL Used Fly! Garchomp used WTF!
Flash Cannon - Doesn't work and will hurt the Spider trying to Launch "hard" things"




This list Good?

 

[tennisace]

Absolutely Yes:
Arm Thrust - Hands
Baton Pass - It's a Support pokemon also because it gets wish too. :D
Bullet Punch - He got hands and the speed to pull off one.
Comet Punch - Meh.
Dig - Ground type
Dizzy Punch - Hands
Double Slap - Hands
Earthquake - Ground type
Earth Power - Ground type
Fake-Out - Hands
Fire Punch - To get advantages of his Base attack
Focus Blast - DLL has holes in it hands, It will Launch off one. :D
Focus Punch - Blissey Counter perhaps?
Force Palm - Hands
Gunk Shot - Poison type and 75% accuracy get its advantages of not being broken.
Gravity - Persistant
Ice Punch - LOL GARCHOMP U LOSE.
Mach punch - Hands and to Ohko Weavile. :O
Mega Punch - Hands
Mud Bomb - Ground type
Mud Shot - Ground type
Mud Slap - Ground type
Poison Jab - Poison type
Rapid spin - Mr. T has one, and so Forry too. So why not another effective spinner?
Sludge bomb - Poison type
Sucker Punch - Counter to Deoxys-e, perhaps?
Taunt - Hands
Thunderpunch - Hands.
Tickle - Hands
U-turn - Hey This is like Jirachi's Set. Wish/U-turn
Wish - Above ^^

Maybe:
Counter - To be like Wobbuffet. :D
Drain Punch - for Leftovers recovery and power.
Flail - Lol
Gyro Ball - High speed, Low attack base - It's just for in-game
Icy Wind - Yeah, not so flavor-wise.
Needle Arm - Hands
Power Gem - His "Gem" on its head.
Psychic - Same as above ^^
Seismic Toss - Toss it up and down for 100 Damage. :D
Shadow Punch - It works.
Shadow ball - It works from it holes from it hands.
Tri-Attack - To make use of 30% Hax and his nice Sp. Attack base
Charge Beam - To Increase its sp. Attack.
Close Combat - Bye Blissey after I hit you again.
Cross Chop - Same as above ^^
Energy Ball - Bye Swampert.
Flamethrower - LOL FORRY, No Good bye.
Ice Beam - Do I have to say this one?
Stone Edge - It works.

Absolutely No:
Explosion - Too Powerful and not flavor-wise
Fire blast - Too Powerful enough.
Thunderbolt - We don't need a 100% Gyarados counter.
Charge beam and T-punch are enough to 2ohko.
Dark Pulse - Doesn't work.
Any Water attacks - It doesn't work for a spider.
Any Flying moves - What the Hell. DLL Used Fly! Garchomp used WTF!
Flash Cannon - Doesn't work and will hurt the Spider trying to Launch "hard" things"




This list Good?

No. It's way too big, and there are non-attack/filler moves in it.

 

[Yamaha]

No. It's way too big, and there are non-attack/filler moves in it.

You didn't have to quote the whole thing, sir.

and Where? I threw in only Attacking moves and moves that will make use of that move.

 

[billymills]

gravity, wish, taunt, tickle

aren't attacking moves

 

[tennisace]

Baton Pass - It's a Support pokemon also because it gets wish too. :D
Comet Punch - Meh.
Dig - Ground type
Dizzy Punch - Hands
Double Slap - Hands
Force Palm - Hands
Rapid spin - Mr. T has one, and so Forry too. So why not another effective spinner?
Taunt - Hands
Tickle - Hands
Wish - Above ^^
Gyro Ball - High speed, Low attack base - It's just for in-game
Icy Wind - Yeah, not so flavor-wise.
Needle Arm - Hands
Psychic - Same as above ^^
Seismic Toss - Toss it up and down for 100 Damage. :D
Shadow Punch - It works.

Those.

EDIT: Missed Gravity, but you get the point. These are all either non-attacking, support w/attack, or filler.

 

[Mario With Lasers]

Stealing LOLMUDKIPZ's list because it already has a shitload of attacking moves. I might add more once I remember them.

Absolutely Yes:

TMs:
Dig
Earthquake
Poison Jab
Sludge bomb

Level 0 moves:
Fire Punch
Ice Punch
Thunderpunch

Level-up moves:
Arm Thrust
Earth Power
Gunk Shot

Egg Moves?
Fake Out
Force Palm
Sucker Punch


Maybe:

TMs:
Flash Cannon
Focus Blast
Shadow Ball
Energy Ball
Stone Edge
Brick Break

Level-up moves:
Drain Punch
Shadow Punch
Bullet Punch

Egg Moves?
Icy Wind
Power Gem


Absolutely Not:

Explosion
[Fire moves except for Fire Punch]
U-turn - Lol, now tell me how does this thing does a U-Turn.


13 "Absolutely yes" moves and 11 "Maybe" moves. Doesn't seem to be too much, I think.

 

[tennisace]

Yeah for reasons already stated. Where are you going to put all those non-TM yes moves?

 

[latinoheat]

even if this thick mud idea was allowed, it couldn't affect flyers who i would be an absolute joke.

 

[Sunday]

Ok guys, I'd like a bit less debate on the new move (which will enevitably end up in the poll...) and more on the following moves:

Elemental Beams
Close Combat / Cross Chop / Any Fighting type move
Icy Wind
Stone Edge
Other random TM beams like Psychic, Shadow Ball etc.

 

[tennisace]

Lets begin. I don't give a crap about Fire or Electric moves, but for the love of god no Ice Beam. Ground/Ice gets amazing coverage, and they really don't fit. Fire is redundant really, and Electric is meh, but Ice moves don't make sense, and give this great coverage. I'd rather see this use Hp Ice than Ice Beam.

Most fighting moves are fine with me, but no Close Combat. This doesn't need a Base 120 power move with no recoil. Also, this is a defensive pokemon, so the drop in defenses is really redundant.

Stone Edge is a passive yes, because it really doesn't get used, but it's a TM.

As for the rest of the random Special Attacks: Personally they won't be in my movepool, but I don't have a problem with them as long as they're TMs.

 

[Tsukikage]

Elemental Beams- I, personally can't see it using these. I know Nidoking/queen, Tyranitar, and Ryperior can learn them, but I don't like it.

Close Combat / Cross Chop / Any Fighting type move- I think Brick Break and possibly Cross Chop is fine, but Close Combat is a bit of overkill.

Icy Wind- If it matters, I can see this before Ice Beam, but Icy Wind really only gets use in Ubers, where I doubt this will see much use anyway.

Stone Edge- IIRC, every Ground type bar Wormadam learns Stone Edge, so I don't see why not.

 

[Mario With Lasers]

Well Tennis, I tried to clean that list a bit. Gimmick moves were ditched, and the others were splitted between Level-up, Egg and Heart Scale. Not that I'm trying to completely build its movepool, it's just to have a general idea.


Well, at first, no Ice Beam. At most, Icy Wind; it's main use is in Ubers and to slow down Garchomp, but will this thing really need to fear Scarfchomp that much?

Force Palm should be on its movepool. 30% paralysis is a cool effect, and it's a weak move (at least on Handyman) overall.
Brick Break (as breaking Reflect/Light Screen is technically "support") is a good idea, but maybe the Base Power is too high?
Arm Thrust could be useful for breaking Subs, Sash and such, but my problem with it is the same with Brick Break. However, Handyman doesn't have high++ Attack, so why don't we allow all three?

All power to Stone Edge. We're talking about a Ground-type with 76 Base Attack and no Swords Dance/Howl/Meditate here.

"Yes" to Shadow Ball and "maybe" to Psychic. It doesn't seem a move that fits Handyman.

"Maybe" to U-Turn too. The only quadrupede pokémon to get it is Persian, and our Poison/Ground pokémon... Well, it isn't a cat ;[

 

[Hyra]

Anything that's a TM that Sunday listed should make it. Anything else, probably should be allowed too, since this is just a pool of moves the list submitters will use. Really, unless it is overpowering, I wouldn't vote against it, since this is going to have 5 or 6 of its allowed "competitive" moves be support moves. (Encore, Gravity, Spikes, Toxic Spikes, Wish). So yeah... I wouldn't worry about it having too many attack moves.

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

Using Sunday's posts as a spring board, I'll express my belief on the following moves.

Okay guys, I'd like a bit less debate on the new move (which will inevitably end up in the poll...) and more on the following moves:

Elemental Beams

Passively yes but I'm okay if not of them make it.

Close Combat / Cross Chop / Any Fighting type move

Just like Tennis, most fighting moves are fine except Close Combat and maybe Cross Chop.

Icy Wind

Yes to me though probably take up precious space and probably won't get much use, not that I can about the latter.

Stone Edge

Yes, why not. It's a TM so no worries about taking up space.

Other random TM beams like Psychic, Shadow Ball etc.

Yes to any special attack TMs like Energy Ball, Shadow Ball, Shock Wave and the likes except for Psychic, Water, and probably Bug type moves.

 

[RobertM]

We have to give him some offense or else he'll just become set-up fodder for the opponent.


Also, what happened to this guy taking out Garchomp? Isn't that why he has 105 base speed? I'm pretty sure he'll need ice beam/icy wind to do that.

 

[tennisace]

We have to give him some offense or else he'll just become set-up fodder for the opponent.

It has plenty of offense, and believe me, with Encore, this will never be set-up fodder.

Also, what happened to this guy taking out Garchomp? Isn't that why he has 105 base speed? I'm pretty sure he'll need ice beam/icy wind to do that.

You mean Ice Punch and Hp Ice aren't enough to take it out? You need to play more if you don't think thats enough. This thing shouldn't be taking on any Dragon to begin with, because aside from Specsmence, they all carry EQ.

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

This thing shouldn't be taking on any Dragon to begin with, because aside from Specsmence, they all carry EQ.

And Salamence would Hydro Pump/Draco Meteor our eight legged friend to burning pits of hell.

I'm willing to admit that This guy does need some limiting towards attack move, but he does deserve some option in terms of offense that's not from the physical side (punch/slap move frantics >.>)

 

[DougJustDoug]

I don't know why this thread is so much harder to contol than the last one, but there have been a lot of infractions handed out recently. We need to rein this thing in a bit.

Everyone please remember that this topic is for discussing specific attacking moves. Do not post full movesets. Do not discuss abilities. Do not discuss breeding groups. Do not discuss support moves. Discuss attacks. There's a lot of attacking moves in the game, and a lot of implications of those attacks. There's plenty to talk about without revisiting closed topics or poll-jumping ahead.

 

[DDRMaster]

Elemental Beams: No I really don't see how it's using any of these and Thunderbolt and Ice Beam aren't usually on Ground Pokemon.

Cross Chop, Close Combat, and Focus Punch: Absolutely not I personally don't want this to have any 100+ non-STAB moves especially Close Combat. It doesn't make any sense on an utility Pokemon.

Force Palm, Brick Break, and Drain Punch: Yes Force Palm can give Parlysis support, Brick Break will stop Reflect and Light Screen and isn't overpowered at all, and Drain Punch can give it alternate recovery.

Arm Thrust: I don't really care one way or the other.

Icy Wind and Shock Wave: No Same as the Elemental Beams.

U-Turn: Yes As I've said before it can shed it's legs if neccesary.

Elemental Punches: No The only one I could possibly see it getting is Fire Punch and only as a Heart Scale move or a Platinum Move Tutor.

Shadow Ball and Energy Ball: Yes I'm perfectly fine with these and they're TM's so they won't take up a move slot.

Dark Pulse and Psychic: No I'd prefer it didn't get these but I'm not as against them as the Elemental Beams.

Stone Edge: No The same as the Fighting attacks but most Ground Pokemon get it so it's not terrible.

 

[RobertM]

It has plenty of offense, and believe me, with Encore, this will never be set-up fodder.

Good point. Forgot about that.

You mean Ice Punch and Hp Ice aren't enough to take it out? You need to play more if you don't think thats enough. This thing shouldn't be taking on any Dragon to begin with, because aside from Specsmence, they all carry EQ.

Nope. Hp ice does 77.65% - 91.34% WITHOUT Yache. It'll need icy wind (for the second hit) or ice beam. Otherwise that 105 base speed just went to waste.

Elemental Beams: No I really don't see how it's using any of these and Thunderbolt and Ice Beam aren't usually on Ground Pokemon.

Excpept Nidoking/queen. Who happen to be poison/ground just like our hand spider.