Hydreigon [QC 3/3] [GP 0/2]

[Ryuuki]

Well I've never used Iron tail more then a few matches and that was horrible to be honest, but QC wants it so you don't get walled by Fairy-types, but come on you can see the fairy switchin from like a mile away so a double switch isn't that hard to pull of. personally I just let my team handle Fairy-types. Also Impish MEga TTar are 2HKO'ed by Superpower on the switch.

Well I have seen like one Haxorus so far so I don't think he's worth mentioning. Okay the data for Feburary says 1.4% in ou and 0.8% in the suspect test for Haxorus. I don't think he's worth mentioning. The only think I really want to speed creap would be Kyurem-B, and right now he uses mild in most of the cases. so neutral base 95 is the speed benchmark.

Also thanks Colonel M I'll read it through and more likely update the OP with your version, also Scarf is pritty niche but it works now, just spamming U-turn helps you a lot and then just finish of weakened things with draco meteor is really nice. But the mixed set is the really good set right now, it takes care of the DeoSharp + Aegislash core alone.

Random Calcs

-1 40 Atk Life Orb Hydreigon Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Tyranitar: 177-213 (43.8 - 52.7%) -- 18.4% chance to 2HKO
40 Atk Life Orb Hydreigon Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Tyranitar: 265-312 (65.5 - 77.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
236+ SpA Life Orb Hydreigon Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Aegislash-Shield: 231-273 (71.2 - 84.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
236+ SpA Life Orb Hydreigon Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Deoxys-D: 187-221 (61.5 - 72.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Hydreigon: 220-260 (67.6 - 80%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

[Colonel M]

Assuming you have used Hydreigon a lot feel free to update with your own information too. This was mainly written for the dex so it was just a temporary (I barely touched it in Gen 6 but I used Superpower myself).

Make Superpower the first slash by the way. That I totally agree with.

 

[Ryuuki]

Assuming you have used Hydreigon a lot feel free to update with your own information too. This was mainly written for the dex so it was just a temporary (I barely touched it in Gen 6 but I used Superpower myself).

Make Superpower the first slash by the way. That I totally agree with.

Yea I saw that now but it helped me a lot to rewrite some other stuff, but Superpower will be slashed first. And since I write about it I have tested every persons set before commenting, but I really dislike Iron Tail. you miss out too much when you're not using superpower

 

[Cherub Agent]

i didnt really mean that you ned to mention haxorus, just that you had 97 base speed int he skeleton when hydreigon has base 98

 

[Colonel M]

Oh. Fine fine.

Ryuuki - also remove the mention of Superpower 2HKOing Chansey. It doesn't - 40 Atk Life Orb Hydreigon Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 322-380 (45.7 - 53.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock (Atk drop fails to).

 

[Ryuuki]

Oh. Fine fine.

Ryuuki - also remove the mention of Superpower 2HKOing Chansey. It doesn't - 40 Atk Life Orb Hydreigon Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 322-380 (45.7 - 53.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock (Atk drop fails to).

Well as a matter of fact, if you get the max damage roll twice then it's a 2HKO after SR ( 36.2 + 12.5 + 53.9 = 102.6% ) but your point still remains valid so I'll remove the mentioning of 2HKOing CHansey after SR. Chansey needs to take around 20% prior damage before you can safely 2HKO her (around 50%) and you need her down to 75% hp before you can guarantee that 2HKO.

 

[Crazy Horse]

Um why would you have a mild Hydreigon in a priority driven metagame? Also why is iron tail listed over steel wing. Besides not missing all the time steel wing Halts would be hydreigon counters.

0 Atk Life Orb Hydreigon Steel Wing vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Florges: 190-224 (52.7 - 62.2%) -- 98.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
clefable isnt setting up on a switchin:
0 Atk Life Orb Hydreigon Steel Wing vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Clefable: 177-211 (44.9 - 53.5%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
just my 2 cents , add 40 attk EVs to that like the main set and its a guaranteed 2hko

 

[Colonel M]

Hydreigon's typing isn't terrible in some situations. For example, Hydreigon resits both of Rotom-W's STABs. Rash is normally better than Mild, but Mild isn't bad for some scenarios where Hydreigon might have to tank a worst-case-scenario hit.

Steel Wing's biggest problem is this:

0 Atk Life Orb Hydreigon Steel Wing vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Clefable: 177-211 (44.9 - 53.5%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
just my 2 cents , add 40 attk EVs to that like the main set and its a guaranteed 2hko

For starters I don't really like Iron Tail but Steel Wing fails to 2HKO Bold Clefable with Steel Wing. Check it out:

40 Atk Life Orb Hydreigon Steel Wing vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 125-148 (31.7 - 37.5%) -- 90% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Iron Tail is a bit closer, but still very disappointing in damage (probably another reason to have Superpower only as a slash):

40 Atk Life Orb Hydreigon Iron Tail vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 177-211 (44.9 - 53.5%) -- 90.2% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Though honestly gambling on either is ass - Iron Tail at least has a greater chance of 2HKOing a rather annoying threat to Hydreigon.

Ryuuki if you can modify the OP with the combination of your skeleton and mine I can stamp this.

 

[Colonel M]

Mention that Hydreigon can outspeed Haxorus if it pleases. Make an alternate EV spread on the Mixed Attacker for outspeeding Haxorus too.

It is Stealth Rock, not Stealth Rocks.

"40 Attack is necessary to 2HKO Clefable and Sylveon as well as 2HKO Blissey and Chansey with Superpower - the latter needing Stealth Rock to 2HKO reliably."

This one is my bad - mention "with Iron Tail" after Sylveon. Note Chansey needs more than Stealth Rock to be 2HKOed.

"Mild is your preferred nature as Hydreigon resists more Special Attacks then Physical Attacks."

Hydreigon really wants Rash because Bullet Punch and Mach Punch really hurt. There are only a few special attackers that Hydreigon can take a hit from.

"Expert Belt can be used if you dislike the recoil from Life Orb but your damage output will be really hampered."

I want Expert Belt in Other Options because it is a poor item replacement for Life Orb. I would even go as far as stating that I would rather use Choice Specs. Expert Belt is only good for bluffing Scarf and the power loss is tremendous. Dragon doesn't hit anything but Dragon for super effective damage anyway.

Double check your spelling (weekend opponents?) and use my list for Other Options. I think it is superior to yours.

Once done I will stamp this.

 

[dcae]

Scarf Hydreigon is unimpressive, as it is weak and cannot even revenge the main target to revenge nowadays, Char X, due to its low base speed. If you're running Hydrei in OU you should be running mixed or you shouldn't be running it at all. Thus, move it to OO.

Also, after running some calcs, 60 Atk should be the Atk investment on mixed Hydreigon, as it has 97% chance to 2HKO 4 hp/252 def bold chansey after SR, which is very impressive.

Expert Belt is very weak, shouldn't be mentioned outside of OO.

The CB set in OO should have U-turn mentioned 100%, as that is the only reason you would ever even think of using it.

After these changes, I will stamp.

 

[Ryuuki]

Colonel M and dcae ok this should be all the changes you asked for. Fell free to point out anything new if you have something else. As of now the alternetiv spread for the mixed attacker lies under Set details, I'll move if you dissaprove of that.

 

[dcae]

looks good now, this is

1/3

 

[Ryuuki]

looks good now, this is

1/3

Thank you =)

 

[Colonel M]

I kind of dont want Choice Band even in OO - it really isnt an option many, if any, would consider.

Also dcae is illiterate at drawing. ;/

QC Approved 2/3

 

[Ryuuki]

I kind of dont want Choice Band even in OO - it really isnt an option many, if any, would consider.

Also dcae is illiterate at drawing. ;/

QC Approved 2/3

Thanks =)
I'll remove Choice band from OO then. I should hopefully have written this before Friday, not going to promise anything other than before the weekend.

 

[Ryuuki]

Ok I've now updated the OP with a wall of text. Feel free to comment if you have any opinion.

 

[Hegemoth]

I use the Pre-Pokebank Life Orb set - it does what it does - good switch in to Rotom-W, Slowbro, Mandibuzz, Aegislash (pairs with own Aegi pefectly),
name: Mr Dark Spam
move 1: Dark Pulse (I like random flinches)
move 2: Flash Cannon (I like the random SpD drops)
move 3: Draco Meteor (I like free kills)
move 4: Roost (I like my opponents rip hair off their head)
ability: Levitate
item: Life Orb
nature: Modest
evs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe

Consistently switches into
Rotom-W, Slowbro, Mandibuzz, Mixed Aegislash (not that consistentl), Trevenant, other bulky Ghosts, Mew,
it can take a Knock Off if you don't want Life Orb anymore - you still have recovery

Problems that like to switch in: Chansey, Azumarill, Sylveon, Togekiss wihout rocks, SpD Toxic Heatran, AV Conk, AV Tyranitar, SpD Venusaur with Leech Seed/Sleep Powder, Mandibuzz with Toxic, Mawile (takes up to 90 % before killing hydra), Bisharp is not a problem haha

Teammates - something switches in and punishes above pokemon

 

[Ash Borer]

Fire Blast actually isn't that good on Hyreidgon. Dark Pulse 2hkos a lot of steels like Skarm, Aggron, Scizor, and has a chance of 2hkoing max HP ferrothorn even. Conveniently the best two specially defensive steels, Aegislash and Heatran are hit better with Dark Pulse/Superpower! You miss those nice OHKOs or super effective hits on some fire weak targets but you're harder to wall with dark pulse / draco / iron tail / superpower.

So, slash superpower alongside Fire Blast.

Also, add roost into moves, it can be better to want to keep hydreigon healthy than harder to wall for some teams.

Do that and QC 3/3

I still think scarf is decent but its fine in OO

 

[Vandy]

I would prioritize Superpower over Iron Tail, so perhaps slashing Iron Tail alongside Fire Blast and keeping Superpower on its own would be better. I would even consider putting U-Turn as a slash alongside Iron Tail and Fire Blast. I also think Scarf should have its own dedicated set. Hydreigon has the right tools to use a Scarf, sky high special attack stat even without a boosting item, reliable Dark stab, Draco Meteor and U-Turn are wonderful for a Scarfer and then one more move to play around with.

 

[AccidentalGreed]

Ryuuki please update the title of the thread with the new QC check. Additionally, if you're still willing to do a little extra work, please organize the Checks and Counters section into separate categories like other completed analyses have been doing.

 

[CyclicCompound]

Hey, so I was reading your overview and it seemed pretty good except for one thing: there are no mentions of the Pokemon that can (depending on the set) basically switch in for free. Either Sylveon/Clefable or Chansey get a free switch-in depending on whether you run Iron Tail or Superpower, respectively, and Conkeldurr can switch in on almost anything (Draco has a slight chance to 2HKO, but the probability of Conk living and healing back up with Drain Punch is far too much of a risk).

In my experience with Hydreigon in Gen VI this was one of its main downsides, as none of those Pokemon are ones you particularly want to give free turns to.

 

[Aragorn the King]

Aegislash is weak to Ground, Fire, Dark, and Ghost, and Hydreigon is immune to or resistant to all four. Hydreigon is weak to Ice, Fairy, Fighting, Dragon, and Bug, and Aegislash is immune to or resistant to all five. I feel like mentioning it as a defensive and offensive partner would be good.

Also, Azumarill can take steel attacks fine. I think it's safe to put it as a counter, regardless of Hydreigon's moveset.

 

[Ryuuki]

Ash Borer I can see your point about Roost but I feel like whenever I use it it feel like I've could have inflicted more damage.
But I would also like to make a point about Chrunch, it can be a great way to get past mirror coat Deo-D, whom I've seen quite a few times on the ladder. so you swap it out for either Dmeteor of FBlast, thoughts on it?

AccidentalGreed sure I'll change those things. but the gp change will come when I've done those changes.

CyclicCompound true that, I'll that to the overview in form of clefable and cunkeldurr.

finncent1 yea Azumarill can switch in on anything not namned charge beam so it's a pritty good counter, thanks for pointing that out. I'll also mention Aegislash as a good partner.

 

[Unowninator]

Ash Borer I can see your point about Roost but I feel like whenever I use it it feel like I've could have inflicted more damage.
But I would also like to make a point about Chrunch, it can be a great way to get past mirror coat Deo-D, whom I've seen quite a few times on the ladder. so you swap it out for either Dmeteor of FBlast, thoughts on it?

Uh, Dark types are immune to Mirror Coat.

 

[Ryuuki]

Uh, Dark types are immune to Mirror Coat.

Oooooooh riiiiight, I'm stupid... screw that then. Thanks