Gen 1 Persian (UU) [QC 2/2] [GP 2/2]

[Plague von Karma]

This is from a draft that was kept prior to the launch of the RBY UU Analysis Project.

[OVERVIEW]

Persian's Speed and access to STAB Slash help make it a premier revenge killer and late-game sweeper in RBY UU. Outrunning every relevant Pokemon except Dugtrio, Persian can almost always make use of its high damage output from Slash. In addition, this high Speed makes Persian effective against Wrap users, most notably Tentacruel, allowing it to switch in and threaten to damage them with Slash or cripple them with Toxic. Persian will usually KO at least one Pokemon during a game thanks to the sheer power of Slash. Persian's bulk is also appealing, surpassing that of other fast threats like Kadabra and Dugtrio, allowing it to function much more effectively late-game. This bulk also makes it more viable to switch in on moves like Body Slam, which can't paralyze it thanks to Persian being Normal-type. All things considered, Persian is a UU staple.

However, Persian's attacking stats are a bit middling, making Slash its main form of damage. To make matters worse, Persian is particularly lacking in physical coverage, with only Hyper Beam available as a second viable option. As a result, Persian relies on its middling special movepool to cover for Pokemon that resist Normal-type moves, making it relatively easy for Pokemon like Haunter to come in and threaten it. Persian is also crippled by paralysis in a big way, as it relies heavily on its Speed to sweep and threaten Wrap users, so it can be forced out by paralysis inducers if it can't KO them first.

[SET]
name: Revenge Killer
move 1: Slash
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: BubbleBeam
move 4: Toxic / Hyper Beam

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========

Slash is the mandatory backbone of Persian's damage output, sporting a 99.6% critical hit rate. Thunderbolt allows Persian to hit bulky Water-types—especially Gyarados—for better damage with a paralysis chance as a bonus. BubbleBeam lets Persian fight Golem, and the Speed drop can allow it to knock out Dugtrio. Toxic most notably allows Persian to poison Dragonite using Agility, making a Dragonite Wrap sweep near impossible; however, Dragonite's offensive presence outside of this remains significant. Alternatively, Hyper Beam can be used over Toxic for a slight boost in power, which can be crucial when taking down Pokemon like Electabuzz and Kadabra, which threaten it with paralysis. The KO ranges for Hyper Beam aren't much larger than Slash, though, so it should only be used if you want Persian to be a sweeper.

Persian's playstyle is fairly straightforward; it is a cleaner that revenge kills when possible. Generally, Persian should be used once Pokemon that can paralyze it or resist Slash have been put into range for a KO from Slash. Persian can often switch into weakened Tentacruel attempting to use Wrap, as Persian forces it out by the threat of a KO. Persian's other likely point of entry is your own Tentacruel's Wrap, which gives Persian an excellent shot at KOing foes outright with little to no opposition. Persian is also excellent at coming in on Pokemon using Rest, 3HKOing even bulkier threats like Vaporeon and Hypno.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Persian can utilize Body Slam over Toxic to assist teams poor at distributing paralysis. However, its damage is a far cry from Slash or Hyper Beam, relying heavily on Persian's innately high critical hit rate. However, Thunderbolt or BubbleBeam can be removed instead at the price of coverage should a team not require either of them. Screech can be used alongside Hyper Beam to KO sooner than Slash + Hyper Beam, though the foe can switch out to try and force a recharge, thus leaving Persian at risk of being paralyzed or even KOed. As a result, this option is very risky.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Haunter**: Haunter is the only viable RBY UU Pokemon that's immune to Slash, which makes it an excellent counter to Persian, preventing it from making any progress until Haunter is KOed. As such, it's best to keep Persian hidden until Haunter has been removed. Persian's Thunderbolt is only a possible 6HKO, while Haunter can 4HKO using its own Thunderbolt or threaten sleep from Hypnosis. So long as Haunter is active, focus on KOing it or baiting it into exploding.

**Paralysis Inducers**: Electabuzz, Kadabra, and Raichu all threaten to end Persian's run using Thunder Wave, which makes it noticeably less threatening overall. However, should they be in KO range, Persian is capable of shutting them down before they get the chance to do so. As a result, these are only checks if they are at full HP. Hypno is also notable for being among the only paralysis inducers not 2HKOed by Slash, though Hyper Beam can KO it from half health, and Persian is excellent at exploiting it as it uses Rest. Tangela can utilize Mega Drain to save itself from a Slash 3HKO and paralyze Persian with Stun Spore. Dragonite is also notable for its bulk, easily taking a Slash and paralyzing Persian in return. While Persian can use Toxic to outdamage Wrap from Dragonite, it's still problematic for the cat due to its significant damage aside from Wrap.

**Kangaskhan**: Kangaskhan 2HKOes Persian with Body Slam + Hyper Beam. If Kangaskhan is already in a tight spot, such as in 2HKO range from Slash, it can still use Hyper Beam to deal at least 65% damage to Persian, putting it in range for Dugtrio to revenge kill it. In addition, Kangaskhan has access to Counter, which allows it to situationally hit Persian or a switch-in for massive damage. This makes it a fair absorber of Hyper Beam as well; the subsequent Counter outright OHKOes Persian if it hits a high damage roll.

**Articuno**: Articuno can use Agility to outspeed Persian and 2HKO it with its nuclear Blizzard. This makes it a fine check. In addition, it's only 3HKOed by Persian's Slash 57.2% of the time, allowing the opponent to take risks if needed. However, a critical hit from Thunderbolt puts Articuno in range of Hyper Beam. Furthermore, consecutive critical hits from Thunderbolt can 2HKO it should Hyper Beam not be used.

**Bulky Water-types**: Omastar resists Persian's Slash and can 2HKO it in return with Hydro Pump. Persian can try using Thunderbolt, but it's only a 4HKO, so a critical hit is needed to outdamage Rest's healing. Alternatively, Poliwrath makes a decent check, coming in on Slash to use STAB Submission and put Persian in KO range of a subsequent attack. However, Persian's Slash is still a very favorable 3HKO, so Poliwrath isn’t necessarily consistent.

**Golem**: If Persian lacks BubbleBeam, Golem stonewalls it while possessing a very favorable 2HKO with Earthquake. Furthermore, Golem is an excellent counter to Hyper Beam sets, being able to comfortably absorb the hit and deal significant damage in return. Plus, it doesn't fear BubbleBeam from full health unless Persian lands a critical hit. However, Golem can't necessarily switch in on Persian if its moveset hasn't been revealed, as it risks losing half its health from BubbleBeam.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Plague von Karma, 236353], [Shellnuts, 491544], [phoopes, 96315]]
- Quality checked by: [[Volk, 530877], [Sevi 7, 505149]]
- Grammar checked by: [[lotiasite, 302985], [Estronic, 240732]]

 

[Volk]

This is exciting: my first post and my first QC. Bear with me.

Meta Stuff:

If Persian isn’t coming in on an opponent’s Wrap, it’s likely coming in through the use of your own Tentacruel’s Wrap, which gives it an excellent shot at KOing its checks outright with little to no opposition.

Persian is also quite good at coming in on predicted rest. Persian can come in on and 3HKO even some of the bulkiest threats like Vaporeon and Hypno. Probably worth noting.

**Haunter**: Haunter is the only viable UU Pokemon that’s immune to Slash, which makes it an excellent counter to Persian. Persian’s Thunderbolt is just a possible 6HKO, while Haunter can threaten with a 4HKO using its own, or threaten it with Sleep from Hypnosis.

I think you are underselling Haunter just a little bit. Haunter is the Persian check and basically prevents Persian from doing anything so long as it remains alive. Regardless, everything you say about it is true. I just think this fact ought to be very clear.

Poliwrath is also capable of coming in on Slash and dealing major damage to Persian using STAB Submission, and KOing it with a subsequent Surf.

This is fine. Just want to note that not all Poliwrath carry Submission or Surf, with quite a few carrying neither. Also Submission+Surf isn't guaranteed to KO, though I think it is more likely than not.


Grammar Stuff:

Outrunning Tentacruel, Kadabra, and even Electabuzz

Saying "even Electabuzz" is kind of weird, considering Electabuzz is the same speed as Kadabra.

It’s very rare to not see Persian leave a dent in a team during a game thanks to the sheer power of Slash, and can be seen as a UU staple.

Break this into two sentences. I think "...power of Slash. Persian can be seen..." is a bit more understandable.

and the Speed drop can allow it to potentially catch out Dugtrio

Replace "out" with "and knock out."

However, Hyper Beam can be used over Toxic of these choices for a slight boost in power, which can be crucial when taking down Pokemon like Electabuzz and Kadabra, which threatens paralysis.

Cut "of these choices."

In this case, though, the KO range boost is mediocre, and giving up these options should be a last resort.

I'm really not sure what you mean by this sentence. Please rewrite or elaborate.

While Persian can use Toxic to make Dragonite take more damage than it deals, it’s still problematic.

Just add "for Persian" or "for the cat" (if you are feeling cheeky) after "problematic" to clarify the sentence a little.

Particularly Omastar, for its resistance to Persian’s Slash as well as high offensive power enabling it to at least 3HKO Persian in return. In fact, if it uses Hydro Pump, it has a guaranteed 3HKO.

This is a fragment. Try something along the lines of "Omastar resists Persian's Slash and is capable of 3HKOing it in return." Also consider mentioning that Thunderbolt is only a 4HKO.

 

[Plague von Karma]

snip

Implemented all of this!

 

[Volk]

Time for some more QCing!

revenge-killer

Apparently revenge kill and its variants aren't hyphenated. Consider changing.

This also makes it effective against users of Wrap, most notably Tentacruel, due to its high Speed and damage output.

I'm not a fan of this sentence structure and it feels a bit redundant with the previous sentence. Maybe try something like, "When paired with a high damage output from Slash, this high speed makes Persian effective against Wrap users, most notably Tentacruel."

As a result, Persian will often find itself being forced out if it can’t KO them with Slash first.

Replace "them" with "the opposing Pokemon" or something like that.

name: BubbleCat (Revenge Killer)

Not sure how I feel about set names. I'd just stick with Revenge Killer.

Slash is the main thing that makes Persian viable thanks to its near-guaranteed critical hit and should be seen as a mandatory pick for Persian’s first move.

Break this into two sentences, specifically after the word "hit."

particularly Gyarados

"especially Gyarados"

However, Hyper Beam can be used over Toxic for a slight boost in power, which can be crucial when taking down Pokemon like Electabuzz and Kadabra, which threatens paralysis.

Change "threatens" to "threaten."

**Haunter**: Haunter is the only viable UU Pokemon that’s immune to Slash, which makes it an excellent counter to Persian, preventing it from making any progress so long as it isn't KOed. Persian’s Thunderbolt is only a possible 6HKO, while Haunter can threaten with a 4HKO using its own, or threaten it with Sleep from Hypnosis. So long as Haunter is active, Persian isn't likely to make progress until one of its teammates KOs it or Haunter explodes.

After "6HKO," change to "while Haunter can 4HKO using its own, or threaten it with Sleep from Hypnosis.
Also, consider adding a sentence suggesting hiding Persian until Haunter is dealt with. Otherwise, your opponent will probably play more cautiously with Haunter. It's a similar dynamic to hiding Zapdos from Rhydon.

Omastar resists Persian's Slash and can 3HKO it in return with Hydro Pump

Omastar 2HKOs Persian with Hydro Pump (and has a small chance to do so with Surf as well). This may have been my mistake.

Persian can try using Thunderbolt, but it's only a 4HKO, which will force a Rest from Omastar at best.

Not sure if I'd recommend resting on Persian, as it has a high critical hit rate. Maybe cut it the last part? I'm not sure, up to you.

Should Poliwrath use Submission, it's capable of coming in on Slash and dealing major damage to Persian using STAB Submission, and KOing it with a subsequent attack.

Change "use Submission" to "carry Submission." Also consider introducing Poliwrath. The swap from Omastar is a bit jarring.

That's about it. The majority of the changes are grammar-based; only like two or three suggestions were metagame based. Let me know when you implement them and I will most likely approve for a QC. Cheers!

 

[Plague von Karma]

Snip

Implemented!

 

[Volk]

Looks good to me.

QC 1/2!

 

[Sevi 7]

Not finished with this QC, but this is what I got for now.

In the overview,

• Persian is a premier revenge killer and late game sweeper
• have more detail than "get something done"
• Change it to the high damage power of slash
• The part with Tentacruel's surf is confusing and i doesn't really need to be there. I think it should just be deleted.
• Instead of saying persian leaves a dent, how about saying it can KO
• I don't think Persian is a staple. It's common and powerful but I think saying a staple is overselling it
• I think a quick mention of its bulk would be good. It's not bulky or anything, but it is bulkier than it's fast competition of Dugtrio, Kadabra and Buzz, which does matter in the late game, and Persian can take them all on 1v1 if there's no hax.
• For the problems, maybe say that Persian is reliant on slash and doesn't have any other consistent way to damage.
• Persian doesn't draw in paralyzers and will actually switch into them to revenge kill. However, one of Persian's biggest selling points is its speed and Paralysis obviously takes that away.

For set details
When talking about Persian's playstyle, I think it's better to not talk about Tauros since it's in a completely different tier, even if Tauros is infamous.

 

[Plague von Karma]

snip

I've made a bunch of edits in addition to these points, I definitely didn't describe Persian well enough. Mind giving it another look?

 

[Volk]

Figured because you said you made major edits I'd make sure my QC still applies.

Outrunning Tentacruel, Kadabra, and Electabuzz, Persian can almost always get make use of its high damage output from Slash.

Cut "get." Also, up to you, but I realized you can just say "outspeeds every relevant Pokemon besides Dugtrio." Your version may be more clear to newer players, however, so the call is yours.

All things considered, Persian can be seen as a UU staple.

Unlike Sevi, I am pretty comfortable with calling Persian a UU staple. It's currently in A Rank and I really can't see an argument for anything lower than A-, maybe B+. Persian is definitely prominent enough to be a staple. I agree with the rest of his points, however.

Persian is also crippled by paralysis in a big way, as it relies heavily on its Speed to sweep and threaten Wrap users, which can sometimes lead to it being forced out if it can't KO them first.

It's a little unclear who "them" is in this sentence. Consider revising.

If Persian isn’t coming in on an opponent’s Wrap, it’s likely coming in through the use of your own Tentacruel’s Wrap, which gives it an excellent shot at KOing its checks outright with little to no opposition.

Who is the "its" in "its checks?" Tentacruel? Persian? Honestly, I think you can just say "opposing Pokemon" or something.

I didn't want to rifle through your grammar again so I stuck to critiques that were either meta-relevant or openly influenced the readability of the article. It still looks really good and your revisions make it even more clear. Still excellent.

 

[Plague von Karma]

snipped

Implemented this bit

 

[Sevi 7]

Alright here's my QC
Overview

• Say Persian often KOes during a game. I've seen plenty of games where it doesnt KO anything

Set Description

• How about Slash is Persian's main attacking moves instead of what makes it viable and then that also explains why it's always ran
• I think saying 99.6% chance to crit is better for people less familiar with RBY in general
• Drop decent damage from the Thunderbolt. Just saying it hits is better
• I would get rid of the part about Dragonite dealing less damage. It stops wrap but Dragonite can still sweep with B Slam or H Beam or whatever.
• Add Hypno to the list of Pokemon for Hyper Beam. That's honestly the pokemon I've killed the most with H Beam over Slash
• So the line about H Beam not being bigger. Playing late-game Persian offense is a game of chip and that extra 10% means you have to chip less and gamble with Wrap less. It does end up making a difference and makes sweeping a bit easier. I would say something about this instead of teams that need it. Honestly Hyper Beam is better than Toxic, but some teams need Toxic. Its really the other way around
• In the second paragraph I would say have been put in range to be koed, instead of range of slash. Since having them in TBolt or H Beam is good enough

Other Options

• Thunderbolt or Bubblebeam can be dropped to fit in a different attack on Persian. Obviously this means persian has a weakness, but these kinds of sets are occasionally ran when a team can sufficiently handle that weakness
• Screech + H Beam can kill faster than just Slash or Slash + H Beam. It's not something you see, but im thinking it's worth a mention since it might just be underdeveloped meta or a niche that just instead explored enough.

Checks and Counters

• I don't know what stopping Persian's progress means tbh
• I would say it's important to focus on KOing Haunter or baiting it to explode.
• For Articuno I would add that two Thunderbolt crits or a Thunderbolt + Hyper Beam crit has a chance to kill Articuno. So that's what Persina should go for and something that Articuno should be aware of.
• I would add Golem as a check. it can come in on Slash and threaten to explode. It's not a solid check, especially since crit Bubblebeam OHKOes, but I think it's worth mentioning.

 

[Plague von Karma]

snip

Implemented this and added Counter Kang's utility against HB Persian as well, which is something I forgot. Is this all set for QC 2/2 then?

 

[Sevi 7]

The only thing is for Articuno check, Thunderbolt and a critical hit Hyper Beam has a small chance to kill.

Change that and it's QCed.

 

[Plague von Karma]

The only thing is for Articuno check, Thunderbolt and a critical hit Hyper Beam has a small chance to kill.

Change that and it's QCed.

Implemented!

Ready for GP

 

[Adeleine]

AM GP :)
Add/Fix Remove Comment
(AC)/(RC): Add/Remove Comma
(RD): Remove Dash

Hide

[OVERVIEW]

Persian’s Speed and access to STAB Slash help make it a premier revenge killer and late-game sweeper in RBY UU. Outrunning every relevant Pokemon except Dugtrio, Persian can almost always make use of its high damage output from Slash. In addition, this high Speed (capitalizaiton) makes Persian effective against Wrap users, most notably Tentacruel, allowing it to switch in and threaten to damage them with Slash or cripple them with Toxic. Persian will often usually (subjective/kinda nitpicky but "often KO at least one mon" feels like a slight undersell for a "premier" mon) KO at least one Pokemon during a game (RC) thanks to the sheer power of Slash. Persian's bulk is also appealing, being bulkier than surpassing that of other fast threats like Kadabra and Dugtrio, allowing it to function much more effectively late-game. This bulk also makes it more viable to switch in on moves like Body Slam, which can't paralyze it thanks to Persian being Normal-type. All things considered, Persian can be seen as is a UU staple.

However, Persian does have some problems. Persian’s attacking stats are a bit middling, making Slash its main form of damage. To make matters worse, Persian is particularly lacking in physical coverage, with its only viable options being Slash, and to a much lesser extent, Hyper Beam. only Hyper Beam to give it a barely viable second option. (check if this vibes with you tone/content wise, especially "barely") As a result, Persian relies on its middling special (capitalization, bc it doesn't refer to the stat) movepool to cover for Pokemon that resist Slash, Normal, (bc Hyper Beam) making it relatively easy for Pokemon like Haunter to come in and threaten it. Persian is also crippled by paralysis in a big way, as it relies heavily on its Speed to sweep and threaten Wrap users, which can sometimes lead to it being forced out if it can't KO the paralysis inducer first. so it can be forced out by paralysis inducers it can't KO first. ("sometimes" doesn't feel necessary, but if it is, of course re add it.)

[SET]
name: Revenge Killer
move 1: Slash
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: BubbleBeam
move 4: Toxic / Hyper Beam

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========

Slash is Persian's main attacking move, thanks to STAB and its 99.6% critical hit rate. This should be seen as a mandatory pick for Persian’s first move, as it is the mandatory backbone of Persian's damage output. output, sporting a 99.6% critical hit rate. Thunderbolt allows Persian to hit bulky Water-types - especially Gyarados - for Water-types—especially Gyarados—for better damage with a paralysis chance as a bonus. BubbleBeam gives Persian the opportunity to lets Persian fight Golem, and the Speed drop can allow it to potentially knock out Dugtrio. Toxic most notably (to prevent whiplash from "however") allows Persian to poison Dragonite attempting to use Agility, which makes it near-impossible for it to sweep using Wrap; using Agility, making a Dragonite Wrap sweep near-impossible; however, its offensive presence outside of this remains significant. Alternatively, Hyper Beam can be used over Toxic for a slight boost in power, which can be crucial when taking down Pokemon like Electabuzz and Kadabra, which threaten paralysis. However, the KO ranges for Hyper Beam aren't much larger than Slash, so it should be used if you want Persian to be a sweeper. (did you mean "should be", or should it be "should not be"? after you answer that I'll get back to that sentence)

Persian’s playstyle is fairly straightforward, in that it should be used to close out the game and revenge kill when possible. straightforward; it is a cleaner that revenge kills when possible. Generally, Persian should be used once its checks - namely those Pokemon that can paralyze it or resist Slash (RD) have been put into range for a KO from Slash. Persian can often find points of entry through enter via weakened Tentacruel attempting to use Wrap, as it will be forced Persian forces it out by the threat of a KO. If Persian isn’t coming in on an opponent’s Wrap, it’s likely coming in through the use of Persian's other likely point of entry is your own Tentacruel’s Wrap, which gives it an excellent shot at KOing opposing Pokemon foes outright with little to no opposition. Persian is also excellent at coming in on Pokemon using Rest, 3HKOing even bulkier threats like Vaporeon and Hypno.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Should a team be poor at distributing paralysis, Persian can utilize Body Slam over Toxic to assist with it. teams poor at distributing paralysis. However, the its damage is a far cry from Slash or Hyper Beam, relying heavily on Persian’s innately high critical hit rate. However, Thunderbolt or BubbleBeam can be removed instead at the price of coverage should a team not require either of them. Screech can be used alongside Hyper Beam to KO sooner than Slash + Hyper Beam, though the foe can switch out to try and force a recharge, thus leaving Persian at risk of being paralyzed or even KOed. As a result, this option is very risky.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Haunter**: Haunter is the only viable UU Pokemon that’s immune to Slash, which makes it an excellent counter to Persian, preventing it from making any progress in game state so long as it isn't until Haunter is KOed. As such, it's best to keep Persian hidden until Haunter has been removed. Persian’s Thunderbolt is only a possible 6HKO, while Haunter can 4HKO using its own (RC) or threaten it with Sleep sleep from Hypnosis. So long as Haunter is active, it's important to focus on having it KOed or baited focus on KOing it or baiting it into exploding.

**Paralysis Inducers**: Electabuzz, Kadabra(AC), and Raichu all threaten to end Persian’s run using Thunder Wave, which makes it noticeably less threatening overall. However, should they be in KO range, Persian is capable of shutting them down before they get the chance to do so. As a result, these are only checks if they are at full HP. Hypno is also notable for being among the only paralysis inducers that aren’t outright not 2HKOed by Slash, though Hyper Beam can KO it from half health, and Persian is excellent at exploiting it as it uses Rest. Tangela can also utilize Mega Drain to save itself from a Slash 3HKO and paralyze Persian with Stun Spore. Dragonite is also notable for its bulk, easily taking a Slash and paralyzing Persian in return. While Persian can use Toxic to make Dragonite take more damage than it deals, it’s still problematic for the cat. Persian outdamages it with Toxic, but still struggles to break past it. (check content-wise)

**Kangaskhan**: Kangaskhan is capable of 2HKOing Persian with Body Slam and a subsequent Hyper Beam. 2HKOes Persian with Body Slam + Hyper Beam. If Kangaskhan is already in a tight spot, such as in 2HKO range from Slash, it can still use Hyper Beam to put deal at least 65% damage to Persian, putting it in range for Dugtrio to revenge kill it (RC) as it deals 65% minimum. In addition, Kangaskhan has access to Counter, which can allow allows it to situationally hit Persian or a switch-in for massive damage. This makes it a fair absorber of Hyper Beam as well, which - if countered - well; the subsequent Counter (clarity) outright OHKOes Persian if it hits a high damage roll.

**Articuno**: Articuno is capable of boosting its Speed with can use Agility to outspeed Persian and 2HKO it with its nuclear Blizzard. This makes it a fine check. In addition, it’s only 3HKOed by Persian’s Slash 57.2% of the time, allowing the Articuno player to take risks if needed. However, a critical hit from Thunderbolt puts Articuno in range for Hyper Beam. Furthermore, consecutive critical hits from Thunderbolt can work for non-Hyper Beam sets. Beam, and consecutive critical hits do the same for Slash. (I assume this is what you mean, but make sure it goes content-wise)

**Bulky Water-types**: Omastar resists Persian's Slash and can 2HKO it in return with Hydro Pump. Persian can try using Thunderbolt, but it's only a 4HKO; only a critical hit can break Omastar here. 4HKO, so a critical hit is needed to outdamage Rest's healing. (clarity I assume is correct?) Alternatively, Poliwrath makes a decent check. Should Poliwrath carry Submission, it's capable of coming in on Slash and dealing major damage to Persian using STAB Submission, and KOing it with a subsequent attack. check, coming in on Slash to use STAB Submission and put Persian in KO range of a subsequent attack. However, Persian’s Slash is still a very favourable (American spelling) 3HKO, so it Poliwrath isn’t necessarily consistent.

**Golem**: If Persian lacks BubbleBeam, Golem stonewalls it while possessing a very favorable 2HKO with Earthquake. Furthermore, Golem is an excellent counter to Hyper Beam sets, being able to comfortably absorb the hit and deal significant damage in return. Plus, it doesn't fear BubbleBeam from full health unless Persian lands a critical hit. However, Golem can't necessarily switch in on Persian if its moveset hasn't been revealed, due to the risk of as it risks taking over half HP damage from BubbleBeam.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Plague von Karma, 236353], [Shellnuts, 491544], [phoopes, 96315]]
- Quality checked by: [[Volk, 530877], [Sevi 7, 505149]]
- Grammar checked by: [[, ], [, ]]

 

[Plague von Karma]

snip

Implemented, but there are some issues.

To make matters worse, Persian is particularly lacking in physical coverage, with its only viable options being Slash, and to a much lesser extent, Hyper Beam. only Hyper Beam to give it a barely viable second option. (check if this vibes with you tone/content wise, especially "barely")

Hyper Beam is far from "barely" viable, as the analysis shows with some calcs against threats like Articuno. I went with this instead;

To make matters worse, Persian is particularly lacking in physical coverage, with only Hyper Beam available as a second viable option.

While Persian can use Toxic to make Dragonite take more damage than it deals, it’s still problematic for the cat. Persian outdamages it with Toxic, but still struggles to break past it. (check content-wise)

I think some info was lost in translation here, as the Toxic part only applies to Wrap: Dragonite hits brutally hard outside of Wrap. I went with this for now:

Dragonite is also notable for its bulk, easily taking a Slash and paralyzing Persian in return. While Persian can use Toxic to make Dragonite take more damage than it deals with Wrap, it’s still problematic for the cat.

However, a critical hit from Thunderbolt puts Articuno in range for Hyper Beam. Furthermore, consecutive critical hits from Thunderbolt can work for non-Hyper Beam sets. Beam, and consecutive critical hits do the same for Slash. (I assume this is what you mean, but make sure it goes content-wise)

Not quite...2 crit Thunderbolts KO Articuno. I went with this for now;

Furthermore, consecutive critical hits from Thunderbolt can 2HKO it should Hyper Beam not be used.

--

As for this question

However, the KO ranges for Hyper Beam aren't much larger than Slash, so it should be used if you want Persian to be a sweeper. (did you mean "should be", or should it be "should not be"? after you answer that I'll get back to that sentence)

"Should be" is correct. Persian functions more as a sweeper with Hyper Beam because 2HKO ranges are expanded a good bit, which the analysis talks about iirc.

 

[Adeleine]

Implemented, but there are some issues.


Hyper Beam is far from "barely" viable, as the analysis shows with some calcs against threats like Articuno. I went with this instead;

Looks good.

Not quite...2 crit Thunderbolts KO Articuno. I went with this for now;

Ah. Looks good.

I think some info was lost in translation here, as the Toxic part only applies to Wrap: Dragonite hits brutally hard outside of Wrap. I went with this for now:

I'm fine with "problematic" being a bit vague now that it's clear Toxic outdamages Wrap only, but I do think you could trim "While Persian can use Toxic to make Dragonite take more damage than it deals with Wrap," to like "Persian can use Toxic to outdamage (Dragonite's Wrap) (Wrap from Dragonite),"

"Should be" is correct. Persian functions more as a sweeper with Hyper Beam because 2HKO ranges are expanded a good bit, which the analysis talks about iirc.

As is, then, the sentence whiplashes with "however, flaw" -> "so use it if you want to do X". How about adding "only" before "be used"?

 

[Plague von Karma]

I'm fine with "problematic" being a bit vague now that it's clear Toxic outdamages Wrap only, but I do think you could trim "While Persian can use Toxic to make Dragonite take more damage than it deals with Wrap," to like "Persian can use Toxic to outdamage (Dragonite's Wrap) (Wrap from Dragonite),"

Implemented this as:

The KO ranges for Hyper Beam aren't much larger than Slash though, so it should only be used if you want Persian to be a sweeper.

--

As is, then, the sentence whiplashes with "however, flaw" -> "so use it if you want to do X". How about adding "only" before "be used"?

Implemented this as:

The KO ranges for Hyper Beam aren't much larger than Slash though, so it should only be used if you want Persian to be a sweeper.

 

[lotiasite]

check

[OVERVIEW]

Persian’'(apo)s Speed and access to STAB Slash help make it a premier revenge killer and late-game sweeper in RBY UU. Outrunning every relevant Pokemon except Dugtrio, Persian can almost always make use of its high damage output from Slash. In addition, this high Speed makes Persian effective against Wrap users, most notably Tentacruel, allowing it to switch in and threaten to damage them with Slash or cripple them with Toxic. Persian will usually KO at least one Pokemon during a game thanks to the sheer power of Slash. Persian's bulk is also appealing, surpassing that of other fast threats like Kadabra and Dugtrio, allowing it to function much more effectively late-game. This bulk also makes it more viable to switch in on moves like Body Slam, which can't paralyze it thanks to Persian being Normal-type. All things considered, Persian is a UU staple.

However, Persian’'(apo)s attacking stats are a bit middling, making Slash its main form of damage. To make matters worse, Persian is particularly lacking in physical coverage, with only Hyper Beam available as a second viable option. As a result, Persian relies on its middling special movepool to cover for Pokemon that resist Normal moves, making it relatively easy for Pokemon like Haunter to come in and threaten it. Persian is also crippled by paralysis in a big way, as it relies heavily on its Speed to sweep and threaten Wrap users, so it can be forced out by paralysis inducers if it can't KO them first.

[SET]
name: Revenge Killer
move 1: Slash
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: BubbleBeam
move 4: Toxic / Hyper Beam

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========

Slash is the mandatory backbone of Persian's damage output, sporting a 99.6% critical hit rate. Thunderbolt allows Persian to hit bulky Water-types—especially Gyarados—for better damage with a paralysis chance as a bonus. BubbleBeam lets Persian fight Golem, and the Speed drop can allow it to knock out Dugtrio. Toxic most notably allows Persian to poison Dragonite using Agility, making a Dragonite Wrap sweep near- impossible (remove hyphen); however, Dragonite's offensive presence outside of this remains significant. Alternatively, Hyper Beam can be used over Toxic for a slight boost in power, which can be crucial when taking down Pokemon like Electabuzz and Kadabra, which threaten paralysis. The KO ranges for Hyper Beam aren't much larger than Slash though, so it should only be used if you want Persian to be a sweeper.

Persian’'(apo)s playstyle is fairly straightforward; it is a cleaner that revenge kills when possible. Generally, Persian should be used once Pokemon that can paralyze it or resist Slash have been put into range for a KO from Slash. Persian can often enter viaswitch into weakened Tentacruel attempting to use Wrap, as Persian forces it out by the threat of a KO. Persian's other likely point of entry is your own Tentacruel’'(apo)s Wrap, which gives itPersian an excellent shot at KOing foes outright with little to no opposition. Persian is also excellent at coming in on Pokemon using Rest, 3HKOing even bulkier threats like Vaporeon and Hypno.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Persian can utilize Body Slam over Toxic to assist teams poor at distributing paralysis. However, its damage is a far cry from Slash or Hyper Beam, relying heavily on Persian’'(apo)s innately high critical hit rate. However, Thunderbolt or BubbleBeam can be removed instead at the price of coverage should a team not require either of them. Screech can be used alongside Hyper Beam to KO sooner than Slash + Hyper Beam, though the foe can switch out to try and force a recharge, thus leaving Persian at risk of being paralyzed or even KOed. As a result, this option is very risky.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Haunter**: Haunter is the only viable UU Pokemon that’'(apo)s immune to Slash, which makes it an excellent counter to Persian, preventing it from making any progress until Haunter is KOed. As such, it's best to keep Persian hidden until Haunter has been removed. Persian’'(apo)s Thunderbolt is only a possible 6HKO, while Haunter can 4HKO using its own or threaten sleep from Hypnosis. So long as Haunter is active, focus on KOing it or baiting it into exploding.

**Paralysis Inducers**: Electabuzz, Kadabra, and Raichu all threaten to end Persian’'(apo)s run using Thunder Wave, which makes it noticeably less threatening overall. However, should they be in KO range, Persian is capable of shutting them down before they get the chance to do so. As a result, these are only checks if they are at full HP. Hypno is also notable for being among the only paralysis inducers not 2HKOed by Slash, though Hyper Beam can KO it from half health, and Persian is excellent at exploiting it as it uses Rest. Tangela can utilize Mega Drain to save itself from a Slash 3HKO and paralyze Persian with Stun Spore. Dragonite is also notable for its bulk, easily taking a Slash and paralyzing Persian in return. While Persian can use Toxic to outdamage Wrap from Dragonite, it’'(apo)s still problematic for the cat due to its significant damage aside from Wrap.

**Kangaskhan**: Kangaskhan 2HKOes Persian with Body Slam + Hyper Beam. If Kangaskhan is already in a tight spot, such as in 2HKO range from Slash, it can still use Hyper Beam to deal at least 65% damage to Persian, putting it in range for Dugtrio to revenge kill it. In addition, Kangaskhan has access to Counter, which allows it to situationally hit Persian or a switch-in for massive damage. This makes it a fair absorber of Hyper Beam as well; the subsequent Counter outright OHKOes Persian if it hits a high damage roll.

**Articuno**: Articuno can use Agility to outspeed Persian and 2HKO it with its nuclear Blizzard. This makes it a fine check. In addition, it’'(apo)s only 3HKOed by Persian’'(apo)s Slash 57.2% of the time, allowing the Articuno playeropponent to take risks if needed. However, a critical hit from Thunderbolt puts Articuno in range forof Hyper Beam. Furthermore, consecutive critical hits from Thunderbolt can 2HKO it should Hyper Beam not be used.

**Bulky Water-types**: Omastar resists Persian's Slash and can 2HKO it in return with Hydro Pump. Persian can try using Thunderbolt, but it's only a 4HKO, so a critical hit is needed to outdamage Rest's healing. Alternatively, Poliwrath makes a decent check, coming in on Slash to use STAB Submission and put Persian in KO range of a subsequent attack. However, Persian’'(apo)s Slash is still a very favorable 3HKO, so Poliwrath isn’t necessarily consistent.

**Golem**: If Persian lacks BubbleBeam, Golem stonewalls it while possessing a very favorable 2HKO with Earthquake. Furthermore, Golem is an excellent counter to Hyper Beam sets, being able to comfortably absorb the hit and deal significant damage in return. Plus, it doesn't fear BubbleBeam from full health unless Persian lands a critical hit. However, Golem can't necessarily switch in on Persian if its moveset hasn't been revealed, as it risks taking over half HP damagelosing half its health from BubbleBeam.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Plague von Karma, 236353], [Shellnuts, 491544], [phoopes, 96315]]
- Quality checked by: [[Volk, 530877], [Sevi 7, 505149]]
- Grammar checked by: [[lotiasite, 302985], [, ]]

gp 1/2, remember that smogon uses the straight apostrophe ' instead of the curly one

 

[Plague von Karma]

magic!

Implemented this, thank you so much!

 

[Astra]

add remove (comments)

Hide

[OVERVIEW]

Persian's Speed and access to STAB Slash help make it a premier revenge killer and late-game sweeper in RBY UU. Outrunning every relevant Pokemon except Dugtrio, Persian can almost always make use of its high damage output from Slash. In addition, this high Speed makes Persian effective against Wrap users, most notably Tentacruel, allowing it to switch in and threaten to damage them with Slash or cripple them with Toxic. Persian will usually KO at least one Pokemon during a game thanks to the sheer power of Slash. Persian's bulk is also appealing, surpassing that of other fast threats like Kadabra and Dugtrio, allowing it to function much more effectively late-game. This bulk also makes it more viable to switch in on moves like Body Slam, which can't paralyze it thanks to Persian being Normal-type. All things considered, Persian is a UU staple.

However, Persian's attacking stats are a bit middling, making Slash its main form of damage. To make matters worse, Persian is particularly lacking in physical coverage, with only Hyper Beam available as a second viable option. As a result, Persian relies on its middling special movepool to cover for Pokemon that resist Normal-type moves, making it relatively easy for Pokemon like Haunter to come in and threaten it. Persian is also crippled by paralysis in a big way, as it relies heavily on its Speed to sweep and threaten Wrap users, so it can be forced out by paralysis inducers if it can't KO them first.

[SET]
name: Revenge Killer
move 1: Slash
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: BubbleBeam
move 4: Toxic / Hyper Beam

[SET COMMENTS]
Set Description
=========

Slash is the mandatory backbone of Persian's damage output, sporting a 99.6% critical hit rate. Thunderbolt allows Persian to hit bulky Water-types—especially Gyarados—for better damage with a paralysis chance as a bonus. BubbleBeam lets Persian fight Golem, and the Speed drop can allow it to knock out Dugtrio. Toxic most notably allows Persian to poison Dragonite using Agility, making a Dragonite Wrap sweep near impossible; however, Dragonite's offensive presence outside of this remains significant. Alternatively, Hyper Beam can be used over Toxic for a slight boost in power, which can be crucial when taking down Pokemon like Electabuzz and Kadabra, which threaten it with paralysis. The KO ranges for Hyper Beam aren't much larger than Slash, (AC) though, so it should only be used if you want Persian to be a sweeper.

Persian's playstyle is fairly straightforward; it is a cleaner that revenge kills when possible. Generally, Persian should be used once Pokemon that can paralyze it or resist Slash have been put into range for a KO from Slash. Persian can often switch into weakened Tentacruel attempting to use Wrap, as Persian forces it out by the threat of a KO. Persian's other likely point of entry is your own Tentacruel's Wrap, which gives Persian an excellent shot at KOing foes outright with little to no opposition. Persian is also excellent at coming in on Pokemon using Rest, 3HKOing even bulkier threats like Vaporeon and Hypno.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Persian can utilize Body Slam over Toxic to assist teams poor at distributing paralysis. However, its damage is a far cry from Slash or Hyper Beam, relying heavily on Persian's innately high critical hit rate. However, Thunderbolt or BubbleBeam can be removed instead at the price of coverage should a team not require either of them. Screech can be used alongside Hyper Beam to KO sooner than Slash + Hyper Beam, though the foe can switch out to try and force a recharge, thus leaving Persian at risk of being paralyzed or even KOed. As a result, this option is very risky.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Haunter**: Haunter is the only viable RBY UU Pokemon that's immune to Slash, which makes it an excellent counter to Persian, preventing it from making any progress until Haunter is KOed. As such, it's best to keep Persian hidden until Haunter has been removed. Persian's Thunderbolt is only a possible 6HKO, while Haunter can 4HKO using its own Thunderbolt (assuming this is what you mean) or threaten sleep from Hypnosis. So long as Haunter is active, focus on KOing it or baiting it into exploding.

**Paralysis Inducers**: Electabuzz, Kadabra, and Raichu all threaten to end Persian's run using Thunder Wave, which makes it noticeably less threatening overall. However, should they be in KO range, Persian is capable of shutting them down before they get the chance to do so. As a result, these are only checks if they are at full HP. Hypno is also notable for being among the only paralysis inducers not 2HKOed by Slash, though Hyper Beam can KO it from half health, and Persian is excellent at exploiting it as it uses Rest. Tangela can utilize Mega Drain to save itself from a Slash 3HKO and paralyze Persian with Stun Spore. Dragonite is also notable for its bulk, easily taking a Slash and paralyzing Persian in return. While Persian can use Toxic to outdamage Wrap from Dragonite, it's still problematic for the cat due to its significant damage aside from Wrap.

**Kangaskhan**: Kangaskhan 2HKOes Persian with Body Slam + Hyper Beam. If Kangaskhan is already in a tight spot, such as in 2HKO range from Slash, it can still use Hyper Beam to deal at least 65% damage to Persian, putting it in range for Dugtrio to revenge kill it. In addition, Kangaskhan has access to Counter, which allows it to situationally hit Persian or a switch-in for massive damage. This makes it a fair absorber of Hyper Beam as well; the subsequent Counter outright OHKOes Persian if it hits a high damage roll.

**Articuno**: Articuno can use Agility to outspeed Persian and 2HKO it with its nuclear Blizzard. This makes it a fine check. In addition, it's only 3HKOed by Persian's Slash 57.2% of the time, allowing the opponent to take risks if needed. However, a critical hit from Thunderbolt puts Articuno in range of Hyper Beam. Furthermore, consecutive critical hits from Thunderbolt can 2HKO it should Hyper Beam not be used.

**Bulky Water-types**: Omastar resists Persian's Slash and can 2HKO it in return with Hydro Pump. Persian can try using Thunderbolt, but it's only a 4HKO, so a critical hit is needed to outdamage Rest's healing. Alternatively, Poliwrath makes a decent check, coming in on Slash to use STAB Submission and put Persian in KO range of a subsequent attack. However, Persian's Slash is still a very favorable 3HKO, so Poliwrath isn’t necessarily consistent.

**Golem**: If Persian lacks BubbleBeam, Golem stonewalls it while possessing a very favorable 2HKO with Earthquake. Furthermore, Golem is an excellent counter to Hyper Beam sets, being able to comfortably absorb the hit and deal significant damage in return. Plus, it doesn't fear BubbleBeam from full health unless Persian lands a critical hit. However, Golem can't necessarily switch in on Persian if its moveset hasn't been revealed, as it risks losing half its health from BubbleBeam.


[CREDITS]
- Written by: [[Plague von Karma, 236353], [Shellnuts, 491544], [phoopes, 96315]]
- Quality checked by: [[Volk, 530877], [Sevi 7, 505149]]
- Grammar checked by: [[lotiasite, 302985], [, ]]

2/2

 

[Plague von Karma]

blessedstronic

Implemented this, should be ready for upload.

 

[xJoelituh]

https://www.smogon.com/dex/rb/pokemon/persian/uu/