Offensive Suicune?

[Mithril]

Here is my latest team. It is built around an offensive Suicune. It attempts to remove its counters, finally allowing it to sweep. Any Suggestions that you can give would be much appreciated and equally tested. Now onto the team.

Heatran
Naive @ Shuca Berry
4 HP/252 SpA/252 Spe
-Fire Blast
-Earth Power
-Stealth Rock
-Explosion
Heatran has become one of my favorite leads in the few weeks. Although it does not always get stealth rock down, it does so against the majority of leads. Also, it provides a nice dragon resist, as well as the ability to use flash fire later on in the battle. Evs and Shuca Berry allow it to survive Earthquake from Swampert, Tyranitar, and Metagross, meaning that Stealth Rock is placed.

: Expect the taunt, so immediately Fire Blast. Normally Fire Blast again for the KO, and set up Stealth Rock later in the battle.

: Immediately Stealth Rock, then proceed to fireblast. If low on hp, switch to Gliscor to resist Earthquake and KO back.

: As Earthquake is not a KO, immediately Stealth Rock. Then switch to Celebi to force out or get the KO with Grass Knot.

: If I predict the Trick, go to Flygon in order to force the Jirachi out. Otherwise, Stealth Rock turn one and proceed to Earth power, predicting an incoming Heatran.

: As taunt is almost always coming, Fire Blast the first turn. Then set up Stealth Rock. Finally switch to Celebi, Flygon, or Scizor to get the KO.

: Either SR the first turn, then switch, or just go straight to Gliscor to resist the Close Combat. Threaten out with Earthquake, probably toxic on switch.

: Unfortunately immediately Fire Blast, hoping that Sleep Powder misses. A least one layer of Toxic Spikes will probably get set up, hindering my Suicune sweep.

: Stealth Rock the first turn, then switch to Gliscor or Suicune in order to threaten.

: Stealth Rock the first turn, then switch to Gliscor in order to threaten with Earthquake.

: Predicting the Taunt, go to Suicune immediately in order to set up.

Scizor
Adament @ Choice Band
168 HP/176 Atk/160 SpD/4 Spe
-Bullet Punch
-Superpower
-Pursuit
-U-Turn
Scizor is an important crux to the team as a whole. My real only solution to Latias, Gengar, Azelf, and Starmie, as Pursuit helps to threaten them all. Also, U-Turn is used early in order to help scout the opponents potential threats for the Suicune sweep. Also, Superpower is one of the few ways to dispense of Blissey on the team, other than Gliscor.

EDIT: Changed to a more specially defensive spread in order to counter Latias and Starmie better.

Celebi
Bold @ Leftovers
252 HP/216 Def/40 Spe
-Thunder Wave
-Grass Knot
-Hidden Power Fire
-Recover
Celebi is my main answer to pokemon such as swampert, as Grass Knot swiftly deals with them. Also a lure for Scizor, as HP Fire makes short work of it. I considered Leech Seed for the first slot, but decided to go with Thunder Wave in order to spread paralysis. This is important because it is able to help Suicune sweep by canceling out its lackluster speed. Also, my main switch in to the opponents Gyarados. Celebi is also very important because it is the only member other than Heatran with a fire move, and it usually dies early game, meaning it is needed to help deal with steel types such as Skarmory and Foretress.

Flygon
Jolly @ Choice Scarf
4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
-Earthquake
-Stone Edge
-Outrage
-U-Turn
The main revenge killer of the team, helping dispose of Gyarados, Salamence, Latias, Jolteon and more. Also, able to threaten Tyranitar with Earthquake. Greatly helps Suicune through scouting of the opponents team with U-turn, and with Scizor I am able to see a lot of my opponents pokemon. With its speed due to Choice Scarf, Flygon is extremely helpful in dealing with frailer pokemon, such as Starmie, with a quick U-Turn for the KO. Also, one of the few pokemon that can truly do damage to Kingdra.

Gliscor
Jolly @ Leftovers
252 HP/40 Def/216 Spe
-Earthquake
-Taunt
-Toxic
-Roost
Although this is the first time I have used Stallbreaker Gliscor, it has been extremely effective. The ability to spread Toxic status around quickly has been key in several battles, as it allows me to stall out opposing walls with Taunt and Roost. Gliscor is also key because it plays the important role of both Lucario and Scizor counter/check, as they give the rest of my team some problems, especially if heatran is dead. Gliscor is also the only real way this team has of countering stall, although it has been extremely effective.

Suicune
Timid @ Leftovers
4 HP/252 SpA/252 Spe
-Calm Mind
-Surf
-Ice Beam
-Hidden Power Electric
The star of the team, and what the entire team was built around. With the offensive Calm Mind set, the only true counter is Blissey, as the three attacks provide near perfect coverage. With the use of Leftovers as the item, I am able to bluff a more defensive set, making Suicune even more dangerous. Also, a very useful Gyarados counter. By having three attacks, it allows Suicune to deal with pokemon such as Salamence that attempt to set up believing it only has Surf and Hidden Power Electric. Also, it is my secondary fire resist if my Heatran dies in the early game. The speed evs allow me to outspeed all base 80 and below pokemon, which is useful, while the hp provides Suicune with extra bulk.
EDIT: Changed to 4 HP/252 SpA/252 Spe in order to outrun Adament Lucario and Adament Mamoswine and have more power.

Credit for images goes to www.arkeis.com

So there is the team. Once again, absolutely any suggestion will be taken into consideration, and I thank you for taking your time to read this RMT.

 

[Mithril]

I will use my 24 hour bump now. Are there any suggestions to help my team out?

 

[Testing...]

Specially based Mixape seems like a huge problem, It outspeeds everything except flygon and can OHKO everything except Suicune who's the focus of this team, and who still wouldn't like taking a grass knot. That said this team looks like it could definitely benefit from having a latias, every Latias set on the smogon dex is very effective so just use the one you feel works best, I personally like the life orb+3 attack and the dual screener which could really help out Suicune.

Honestly, I reccommend you rework this team a bit because having 5 pokemon with 4x weaknesses is a pretty big problem, again light screen latias would alleviate some of this, so I suggest you try latias over Flygon maybe and perhaps a Custom Jirachi lead something along the lines of:
Jirachi Choice Scarf
Jolly 4 Hp. 252 Att. 252 Spe.
Ice Punch
Iron Head
Stealth Rock
U-Turn/Thunderpunch/Trick

If you do decide to rework this team a little more extensively though, remember that Suicune really likes Toxic Spikes support, so try to incorporate a Roserade or Nidoqueen to provide support as well as removing them as well of course

 

[Staraptor Call]

I don't agree that Specially Based Mixape is such a problem. Although Mixape can 2HKO every member of your team, it needs perfect prediction to do so. Flygon can easily outspeed and OHKO Infernape. Also, the only completely safe way for Mixape to switch in is on a locked-in Scizor.

It also isn't necessarily a bad thing to have five 4x weaknesses on your team. This team has at least two resistances to every type except Flying and Rock, and having so many resistances and immunities is what a Bulky Offense team like this one should focus on typing-wise. As long as the 4x weaknesses are not all to the same one or two types, which is not the case, you don't need to worry because there is no single Pokemon that will exploit all five to sweep your team.

Toxic Spikes would help Suicune sweep, so you should try using Roserade instead of Celebi. While Celebi can Paralyze opponents, Roserade's Toxic Spikes are potentially more important because they make it so Vaporeon can't wall Suicune. You already have Flygon and Suicune to counter Gyarados, so that won't be so great a problem. And Roserade can switch into Bulky Waters like Swampert much of the time, since they usually either set up or use Water moves on the switch, rather than using Ice moves. So test out Roserade in place of Celebi.

I hope these suggestions help!

 

[Abutorn]

Hey I got a private message so here's my rate for this team.

Tran looks good better with Celebi so I don't think you should change it. But the Celebi needs work since it's outdated because Hidden Power Fire will not OHKO a standard Scizor so what I think you should do is change it to this more powerful set which works greatly. The Tinkerbell set:

Celebi @ Life Orb
232 HP / 244 SpA / 32 Spe
Nature: Modest
Moveset:
Thunder Wave
Leaf Storm
Recover
Hidden Power Fire

Since I don't think Gliscor works well since it doesn't have synergy with team team, and you have 3 pokemon weak to Ice 2 of them are 4x effective and since you stated above that you want something with taunt why not try Gyarados,

Gyarados @ Leftovers
156 HP / 72 Atk / 96 Def / 184 Spe
Nature: Adamant
Moveset:
Waterfall
Dragon Dance
Taunt
Bounce/ Stone Edge / Earthquake

This set is great because it counters Lucario and Scizor pretty well and takes both of there's stab moves easily and remember the Gyarados has taunt so it'll be able to stop stall easier. I chose the bulky set because I want it to take Moves easier since regular DD set cannot.

Lastly you might want to change your Flygon to Jirachi because you don't have a huge fire weakness and since there's Suicune Gyarados and Heatran you should be scared of anything, not only that but also Jirachi can take hits better then Flygon.

Good luck!

 

[Mithril]

Alright, sorry for not responding any quicker. First of all to Testing: Strangley enough I have not really had trouble with Mixape. It has much difficulty switching in safely, and I can kill with either Suicune or Flygon most of the time. On Latias helping the team, it probably would, but I can't take out my scarfer (although I am currently testing Jirachi over Flygon), as it would leave me fairly vulnerable. Also, I tried out the Jirachi lead, and it just didn't work for me, so I am going to stick with Heatran for now.

To Starraptor Call: I tested out a Roserade, and it just didn't seem to do the job I need it to for the team. Although I am now going to test a Roserade lead, as the Sleep Powder/Toxic Spikes lead is fairly enticing.

To Abutorn: I tested the Celebi set and it was fairly effective, although I greatly dislike being forced into -2 special attack. Would Grass Knot work for this set, or is it simply too weak. If I don't decide to switch to a Roserade lead, I will definately go with the Tinkerbell set. I also have had a lot of issues with opponents utilizing Ice Beam, so Gyrados seems to be working fairly well. I will make the definitive change probably tomorrow, if things continue to go well.

Finally, I have been major issues with Dynamicpunch Machamp, as it continually confuses my team, and there is nothing I can do about it. Are there any suggestions on how I can fix this?

Thanks for all the time it took for the rates, and any more would be greatly appreciated.

-Dukefan5

 

[Setsuna]

Hi. The team looks really solid from a general perspective, good work on that. Though I have a few tips to improve some of the sets that you have there.
The first thing I would do is to change Flygon's nature and use Adamant instead since Gyarados can be revenge killed either by Celebi or Suicune, and something similar happens to DD Mence who even using a +Atk nature can't OHKO Celebi with a LOed Outrage, and you have Scizor anyway for it. Most of the time, if Salamence is using a +Spd nature, Flygon will just tie with it and see how luck acts, so Adamant is a more superior option for Flygon as it allows it to deal more damage with U-turn to the likes of Latias (which Flygon needs to cover on this team), Celebi, Starmie, etcétera. Also, the power that EQ and Outrage get is excellent in terms of revenge killing threats like Metagross and Gliscor for example.

On Scizor, since LO Starmie could be troublesome and it also needs to be able to check Latias (with no HP Fire), I suggest moving some of HP and Atk EVs to SpD in order to make the bug capable of taking Timid LOed Hydro Pump and Draco Meteors better. Try this spread out: 176 HP / 230 Atk / 100 SpD / 4 Spe, Adamant. Don't worry, you are just improving Scizor's set in general in exchange for 9 Atk points.

The last thing I would do is to give Suicune a bit more of Spd points, enough to outpace Mild 208 Spd Salamence, and Jolly Gyarados: 160 HP / 120 SpA / 228 Spd suffices.

Very good team overall. Sorry for the short rate, gl.

 

[franky]

Hello duke,

You can improve this team a bit by helping Suicune sweep. The first thing you need to tweak is its EV spread, try out a simple spread of 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe with a Timid nature. This allows you to outpace Adamant Lucario and Mamoswine; smack them with a boosted Surf first before they hit you. Leftovers makes a great bluffing item, this will usually fish in both of these guys to stay in. If you like the bulk however, aim for max Speed still but pour the surplus between HP and Special Attack as you like it.

For a team like this, it sorta lacks some special pillow to stomach special hits. Scizor is your backbone, and I feel like it needs a better EV investment. Aim for 168 HP / 176 Atk / 160 SpD / 4 Spe for your EV spread. This allows you to lose 10% of power, in exchange for more special bulk. This particular spread allows you to survive two consecutive Choice Specs Draco Meteor from Latias. It also allows you to take special hits better from Starmie - a possible problem.

A minor tweak from looking at this: 252 HP / 216 Def / 40 Spe should be your new spread for Celebi since you chose Hidden Power Fire. It drops your Speed IVs by one, and I simply took out 4 points from Def and placed it on Speed to outpace Jolly Tyranitar.

As for other options, you can try out a Sub variant by replacing Hidden Power Electric with Substitute and tweaking your EVs to 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe with a Timid nature. I feel like you can answer bulky waters with Celebi, and you can go for a more dangerous set if you like. Substitute ensures Blissey will not destroy you with Toxic. This set has more of a direct approach for taking on Blissey. overall gl.

 

[Mithril]

At Setsuna: I am currently testing out the Adament Flygon to see how it goes, although automatically losing to other Flygon and Scarf Jirachi has me slightly worried. I will see how it goes. I have decided to go with Franky's Scizor spread, as it is slightly more bulky, but thanks for the suggestion. As for Suicune, I tested the set and found the more speed seemed useful, so I went with Franky's Suicune set as well. Thanks for the rate.

At Franky: After testing, your Suicune set seemed very effective, so I have dedided to go with it. Also, i have decided to go with the Scizor set, as the inability to take special hits has been bothering me. Finally, I completely forgot about the slight speed drop from HP Fire, so I immediately went with your spread, thanks for catching that. I will test out Substitute, although I feel that HP Electric may be too useful to lose.

Thanks very much for the rates, and any more suggestions would be much appreciated.