Conkeldurr (QC 2/3)

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Overview
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  • very strong, works well both in and out of trick room thanks to average speed
  • good bulk on both sides, further boosted by assault vest
  • stays alive for a while thanks to solid bulk and recovery from its main stab, drain punch
  • stab mach punch is good for killing off low health mons
  • two good abilities: iron fist boosts the power of a lot of conks moves, and guts is great for doing well against pokemon that like to use status such as rotom-w and trevenant
  • good choice of coverage moves to choose from
  • above 2 points make it a versatile mon


Assault Vest
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name: Assault Vest
move 1: Drain Punch
move 2: Mach Punch
move 3: Knock Off
move 4: Ice Punch
ability: Iron Fist / Guts
item: Assault Vest
evs: 108 HP / 152 Atk / 104 Def / 144 SpD
nature: Adamant

Moves
========
  • drain punch is main stab, recovers hp which is very useful, but often doesnt do enough damage thanks to relatively low power
  • mach punch is useful for revenge killing low health pokemon
  • knock off provides solid coverage against ghost types and psychic types, is rly strong and gets rid of the opponents item which is awesome
  • ice punch is also very good coverage against stuff like bulky grounds and flying types
Set Details
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  • assault vest boosts special defense to high levels, so conk can take special hits all day while recovering health with drain punch
  • the evs allow conk to live LO latios psyshock and 2 timid zardy heat waves in sun while keeping as many evs as possible left over for attack
  • adamant for maximum powa
  • if using in trick room, use 0 speed ivs and brave nature
  • iron fist boosts the power of all its attacks except knock off which is useful
  • guts turns burns and stuff against your opp
Usage Tips
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  • works well both in and out of trick room, but the trick room support is still useful
  • drain punch does a shit ton of damage especially w/ iron fist boost
  • conk can easily take hits and do loads of damage back vs stuff like ludicolo
  • use mach punch to finish off low health mons even in tr, cos they might have priority (dont do this if they have a possible quick guard user tho)
  • if the opp can be killed by any move except mach punch, check their team. if they have no fighting resist alive use drain punch. if they do, use knock off.
Team Options
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  • trick room users (cresselia, chandelure, jellicent, dusclops etc.). they also appreciate conkeldurr removing dark types like ttar and bisharp which otherwise are annoying
  • cress in particular can provide useful helping hand support, set up reflect to soften physical attacks, psyshock deals with a lot of conks checks
  • intimidate mons (salamence, gyarados, lando-t, mawile)
  • steel types can take psychic and flying moves aimed at conk. follow me jirachi in particular is good at this, as it can redirect them completely and absorb the hit with ease. heatran is another good one as it compeltely beats talonflame, a big pain for conk

Trick Room Attacker
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name: Trick Room Attacker
move 1: Hammer Arm / Drain Punch
move 2: Mach Punch
move 3: Ice Punch / Knock Off
move 4: Protect
ability: Iron Fist / Guts
item: Life Orb
evs: 96 HP / 252 Atk / 80 Def / 80 SpD
ivs: 0 Spe
nature: Brave

Moves
========
  • hammer arm is your strongest stab, boosted by iron fist. it also lowers your speed so you can outslow even more stuff in trick room
  • drain punch is another strong fighting stab move that can be used over hammer arm if you dont need as much power, but want some sort of recovery
  • mach punch is useful for revenge killing low health pokemon, and gives conkeldurr a better chance outside of trick room
  • protect can shield you from attacks for a turn so your partner can take out an annoying opponent, scout for moves and stall field conditions
  • ice punch is good coverage against stuff like bulky grounds and flying types
  • knock off gives good coverage vs ghost and psychic types, and is easily spammable thanks to removing the foes item
Set Details
========
  • life orb boosts your power so you can hit as hard as possible
  • the evs let you survive a max attack metagross zen headbutt after taking life orb damage, with the rest thrown into spD
  • adamant for maximum powa
  • iron fist boosts the power of all its attacks except knock off which is useful
  • guts turns burns and stuff against your opp
  • poison jab is an option over ice punch to hit fairies
Usage Tips
========
  • works well in trick room, so that support is appreciated
  • drain punch does a shit ton of damage especially w/ iron fist boost
  • you can easily spam hammer arm as long as trick room is up, as it does loads of damage and lowers your speed so you can outslow even more stuff in tr
  • conk can easily take hits and do loads of damage back vs stuff like ludicolo
  • use mach punch to finish off low health mons even in tr, cos they might have priority (dont do this if they have a possible quick guard user tho)
  • if the opp can be killed by any move except mach punch, check their team. if they have no fighting resist alive use drain punch. if they do, use knock off.
Team Options
========
  • the same as the other set lol
  • trick room users (cresselia, chandelure, jellicent, dusclops etc.). they also appreciate conkeldurr removing dark types like ttar and bisharp which otherwise are annoying
  • cress in particular can provide useful helping hand support, set up reflect to soften physical attacks, psyshock deals with a lot of conks checks
  • intimidate mons (mawile is good cos works in tr too). not as useful for this set as it is more offensive and not bulky, but still nice to have
  • steel types can take psychic and flying moves aimed at conk. follow me jirachi in particular is good at this, as it can redirect them completely and absorb the hit with ease


Other Options
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  • rock slide and eq as good spread moves, also provide good coverage
  • stone edge is a more powerful alternative to rock slide, and it gets around wide guard cos no spread
  • poison jab is an option to hit some fairies like sylveon and gardevoir, but only works on the switch unless trick room is up
  • flame/toxic orb along with guts boosts attack up to high levels and also gives u a status absorber, but dies much faster thx to residual damage
  • thunder punch provide additional coverage against stuff like gyarados, but not much else
  • choice band fucking destroys. ice punch ohkos lando-t at -1 atk
  • focus punch with follow me support is rly powerful, especially with iron fist + band

Checks & Counters
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  • fairies take shit from anything except poison jab (togekiss is still hurt by ice punch, mawile+klefki by drain punch)
  • outside of trick room, psychic, flying and fairies can outspeed and do a lot of damage
  • burn on non guts conk is really useful for wearing it down and reducing the damage it does, but you should be sure its iron fist before you do that
  • mega pokemon take shit from knock off, so if they resist fighting they can do quite well vs conk (mega venu, mega garde, mega pinsir)
  • TALONFLAME THE DESTRUCTINATOR
  • togekiss and amoonguss manipulate what move conkeldurr goes for by basically forcing it to use ice punch, which works to conks disadvantage
  • basically any intimidate mon is annoying, but scrafty has to watch out for drain punch, lando-t has to be scared of ice punch and hitmontop is still hit for a decent amount of damage at -1
  • while not a direct counter to conkeldurr, preventing trick room from going up reduces conkeldurrs effectiveness

do I have to use those dumb tags 9.9
 
Last edited:

Laga

Forever Grande
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Your spread is nice, but let's spice it up.

Here is the godly spread by (mostly) Nollan and me - 108 HP / 168 Atk / 104 Def / 128 SpD | Adamant
- 108 HP / 104 Def lives LO Psyshock from Latios whilst spending as few EVs as possible on this (and also keeping HP lower to heal more delicious HP)
- 108 HP / 128 SpD lives two Heat Waves from ZardY in Sun whilst actually spending less EVs than plain spread.
- rest EVs + positive nature in Atk because it has to hit hard

Sure it has a tiny amount less Atk EVs but it is much more physically bulky and heals surprisingly much more when using Drain Punch.

I am p busy with homework atm so I guess I'll check the info in this later. For now change the spread and a quick note to everyone writing / checking: epic spreads are cooler than plain ones.
 

Audiosurfer

I'd rather be sleeping
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ok here are some things Lasagne:
  • definitely go w/ laga's spread, looks pretty solid (although Laga needs to say if zard is modest or timid, if it's timid still mention it tho even though timid really isnt a benchmark)
  • why no life orb iron fist set? i get that avest is cool but i would think that life orb is still effective enough to warrant a set (especially given how hard it hits). would be the same moveset except detect > knock off. at the very least it should have a mention in oo, but a set under avest would be better
  • guts + flame orb should get a mention in oo
  • be sure to mention how trick room setters appreciate how conkeldurr messes up dark types such as ttar and bisharp that would otherwise maim the setters.
  • remove fire punch in oo. thunderpunch doesnt have much coverage either but it hits gyara i guess so worth mentioning
  • mention stone edge for more power (not reduced by spread which makes rock slide p. weak since there's no stab) as well as for the ability to get around wide guard. not sure if it secures any kos but i'll check and get back to you
  • "while not a direct counter to conkeldurr, preventing trick room from going up reduces conkeldurrs effectiveness significantly" <--- get rid of significantly here. gives the impression that conkeldurr cannot be used to success without trick room which isn't true.
 

Laga

Forever Grande
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
  • "while not a direct counter to conkeldurr, preventing trick room from going up reduces conkeldurrs effectiveness significantly" <--- get rid of significantly here. gives the impression that conkeldurr cannot be used to success without trick room which isn't true.
To add to this I would say that you should generally hype Trick Room less; Ass Vest Conk is extremely bulky and can take on a lot of special attackers and physical rock + dark mons both in and out of Trick Room. Obviously keep a mention in Usage Tips and Team Options but don't stress the fact that Conk needs TR.
 
To add to this I would say that you should generally hype Trick Room less; Ass Vest Conk is extremely bulky and can take on a lot of special attackers and physical rock + dark mons both in and out of Trick Room. Obviously keep a mention in Usage Tips and Team Options but don't stress the fact that Conk needs TR.
Imo, Assault Vest is more of a "slap on a team in need of a bulky attacker" thing (aka supporting hyping TR less for this specific set). You should, however, have a second set named "Trick Room Attacker" that looks like:

Trick Room Attacker
########
name: Trick Room Attacker
move 1: Hammer Arm / Drain Punch
move 2: Mach Punch
move 3: Protect
move 4: Ice Punch / Knock Off
ability: Iron Fist / Guts
item: Life Orb
evs: 96 HP / 252 Atk / 80 Def / 80 SpD
ivs: 0 Spe
nature: Brave

The EV spread is ripped right off of my (now Laga's iirc) Gen 5 Conkeldurr analysis; really this set hasn't changed much apart from the ability to use Knock Off now. If you are aiming for heavy Trick Room abuse this is the set you should be using (and make no mistake it is really, really effective).
 
detect > protect on that set. also i'd say slash toxic orb too (or flame orb, not sure which).
Toxic and Flame Orb aren't all that effective imo because they waste your item slot when you could be holding LO. Guts is there for an essential anti Will-O-Wisp option. Iron Fist + Life Orb hits harder than Guts and has more longetivity (my general logic behind status orbs wasting Conk's potential). The status orbs are really best as an OO mention imo since they can provide Spore immunity but that's the only real advantage they hold over IF + LO.
 

Audiosurfer

I'd rather be sleeping
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Ok, that's fair. Also you could just slash detect behind protect or not mention it r something, after thinkin on it no one really used inprison so the extra pp would probably be more useful
 
so i just checked the evs Laga gave and they dont let conk live 2 zardy heat waves in sun oO

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Heat Wave vs. 108 HP / 128 SpD Assault Vest Conkeldurr in Sun: 160-190 (42.3 - 50.2%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO

144 SpD EVs does, so I'm going to change it to that :]

(yes i made sure it was set to doubles)
 
On the first point in the overview, specifically say it can work well in and out of trick room. Your wording is a somewhat confusing.

I also wouldn't call it a revenge killer since it can only pick off threats with low HP. Revenge killer implies it can easily take out most Pokemon after a teammate has fainted.

Also talk about Conkeldurr's versatility since it can run multiple abilities and has many coverage moves.

For the first set:

In the moves tab, mention that Drain Punch's low Base Power causes it to miss out on many KOs. It's not very powerful at all; the recovery is the main point for using it.

Remove Poison Jab from set comments. Togekiss is hit by Ice Punch and Mawile is immune. You can put it in OO and say it hits Sylveon and Gardevoir, but it can only happen on the switch which is too situational to be near the set.\

Add Heatran to the steel-type partners because it cockblocks Talonflame, which reks Conkeldurr.

In usage tips, specify that this is the set that works in and out of Trick Room.

For the second set:

put Protect in the fourth slot because its coverage is more important.

Idk if the evs to live metagross's zen headbutt are relevant but wutevs bulk is bulk

In Moves, mention that Mach Punch gives Conkeldurr a fighting chance outside of Trick Room.

Mention Hammer Arm spam in usage tips.

Take out Salamence, Landoge, and Gyarados of the intimidate partners list because they dont function well in Trick Room, Mawile can stay tho. There isn't really a reason that Conk specifically needs intimidate support, but you can mention it's nice to have I guess.

In other options:

Take out Payback. Knock Off is like 100% better.

In checks and counters:

Mention that it is easier to break through Conkeldurr's Defense stats when facing the Assault Vest set. Heck, Mega Kanga outspeeds and KO's with Double Edge (and i think Return also).

Mention it's easy for Togekiss and Amoonguss to manipulate Conkeldurr because they basically force it to attack it with Ice Punch.

Take out the Toxic mention for countering non-guts Conk because it is near nonexistant in Doubles.

Add Mega Pinsir to the megas since it can switch into all attacks but Ice Punch and Threaten it.

TALONFLAME REKS IT BOTH IN AND OUT OF TRICK ROOM

Also I can't stamp it until I agree with whatever tags you use. They don't have to be the ones in the forum, but I still need to make sure they make sense. wait this isn't the third check man i am tired lol

I hope this post makes sense when I wake up in the morning...

Do these things and I will stamp Lasagne
 
Mention that it is easier to break through Conkeldurr's Defense stats when facing the Assault Vest set. Heck, Mega Kanga outspeeds and KO's with Double Edge (and i think Return also).
252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Double-Edge vs. 108 HP / 104 Def Conkeldurr: 294-348 (77.7 - 92%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
???

did the rest though n_n

edit: also why do you say its easier to break through its defenses on the assault vest set. that sets bulkier?
 
ok wtf that totally KOed me. I guess I could have been at 90% but still that sucks.

I will stamp in the morning when I am sane. :)
 
Put Iron Fist on the first slash in the first set. Considering 3 of its attacks are punch moves with low base power, it needs all the power it can get.

QC 2/3
 
I already posted in the excadrill thread that I was handing these off to whoever wants them because I don't have the time / motivation / I hate the c&c tags :x
 
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