Ampharos [qc 0/3]

I would like to mention Hidden Power fire as an accurate option for the tank or other 3 attack set. Only the following pokemon resist the electric + dragon combo, and hidden power fire hits all of them except Dedenne (who, if you cared and you shouldn't, resists focus blast anyway) super effectively, 2HKO'ing all of them.
Calcs are at max SpA against calculator's default EVs.
Excadrill - (67.9 - 80.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Ferrothorn - (86.3 - 102.2%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
Whimsicott - 216-256 (66.8 - 79.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Magnezone - 188-222 (54.6 - 64.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Steelix - 244-288 (68.9 - 81.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Shedinja - 100%. Of course
Dedenne - hit harder by Thunderbolt, and no one cares

Of course Focus Blast is still fine for turning many 2HKOs into OHKOs with its double base power, and also hits the main special walls a lot harder (blobs, T-Tar, Porygon2)
 
Agreeing with the above. HP Fire (and Grass; plz mention that as well!) is very useful for reliably slamming many of the mons that are usually sent in to eat up the Volt Switch.

That said, I really think that Heal Bell should be the main--and only--move in the third slot, and Focus Blast slashed with the additional offensive options. It's rare that Ampharos will be using anything but Volt Switch or Dragon Pulse. Both are generally safe enough to haphazardly spam (especially Volt Switch, thanks to Mold Breaker), and riding on Focus Blast is always a risky gamble (e.g, do you want to go for the 2HKO on that Nattorei, or risk it getting up a couple layers of hazards?). I've found that the potential utility of Heal Bell is almost always too good to give up for BO / rain, and Ampharos has plenty of chances to get in and use it. Heal Bell adds a pretty strong feeling of safety to the teams Ampharos is used on; and given that Volt Switch tends to bait in slow, defensively oriented Pokemon (Dragon Pulse wards off the more aggressive switch-ins, namely Garchomp and Lando), maintaining momentum shouldn't be too difficult, so dropping Focus Blast isn't too much of a loss.

Additionally, what do you think about a spread of: 124 HP / 252 SpA / 132 Spe for the tank set? It outspeeds neutral min Speed TTar, and, far more importantly, 0-4 Spe Clefable. The HP reduction usually doesn't matter much because of the set having a more offensive intent, and it puts me, at least, at ease not having to tiptoe around one of the best Dragon checks in the tier.

Lastly, I think that Agility should be revisited and possibly given a set. Taking into account that Modest 252 +2 Mega Ampharos outspeeds max Greninja by one point, and it has (in the words of AG) "the power of Specs Jolteon / LO Thundurus" (roughly), cleaning offensive teams is definitely a possibility. Moreover, given Mega Amph's superb defensive and offensive capabilities, finding a chance to set up can be very, very easy. My biggest problem with Agility is losing out on one of Ampharos's most powerful niches: Volt Switch. Agility exchanges the ability to maintain momentum for a chance to punish the switches it causes, and potentially clean very specific team archetypes; any team that isn't offensive usually has a consistent Mega Amph check that doesn't care much about getting outsped. On the brighter side of things, Agilipharos doesn't mind priority as much as many other Speed boosters, and is immune to Thunder Wave (Thund-I), which makes it pretty difficult to stop if it isn't being walled outright. Of course, Scarfers are also problematic, but it's not too difficult to wear them down (or KO them on the switch). Furthermore, there's atypically no indication that Ampharos is running Agility, so the opposing player doesn't have any incentive to keep their Scarf alive for the sole purpose of keeping Ampharos in check. Something along the lines of:

name: Agility
move 1: Agility
move 2: Thunderbolt
move 3: Dragon Pulse
move 4: Focus Blast
ability:Static
item: Ampharosite
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Modest

with a mention of Timid nature / other coverage moves sounds appropriate. It's certainly not better than the two defensive sets--far from, in fact--but it's capable in OU, and imo, should be given more love.
 
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On my phone so will respond fully soon. I tested agility briefly and found it to be shit, I will try again as it is a different meta. I will respond to the other comments later when on my comp
 

Colonel M

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I tried it again and it's okay but Deoxys-S does create a minor headache. It really needs a team built around it for sure. I think for now it is safe in OO.
 
Some minor nitpicks:
44 Spe EVs is needed to outspeed 0 Spe Adamant Azumarill, might be worth investing as you OHKO the non AV variant after SR.
248 HP EVs should be used as 252 EVs gives 384 HP which is divisible by 8

The Agility set loses the Ability to Pivot as Volt Switch is not an option on it which means you can't really bring it out early which in turn will probably reveal the fact that it's packing Agility, it might work well vs offensive teams but will more than likely be a death weight vs stall.
 
Ah you're right, I mixed up AV with CB, AV Azumarill does run 0 speed but can't be OHKO'd by Mega Ampharos regardless, so it doesnt really matter as Play Rough + Aqua Jet will kill Amphy anyway.
 

CyclicCompound

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RestTalk:
  • Remove the 44 Special Attack EVs to 2HKO 252/0 Hippowdon and move them to Special Defense. Physically Defensive Hippowdon is a rarity, and 44 EVs is too precious to give up for it.
  • Team Options needs a little bit of work. For example, you mention VoltTurn teammates—like whom? (e.g. Landorus-T stops Excadrill cold, who is a prime switch-in.) Also, remove the point about Genesect, since it's banned, and mention some other teammates in its place.
  • Mention Heal Bell users under Team Options.
  • Specially Defensive Hippowdon is said to be Mega Ampharos's greatest counter. Name some Pokemon that can beat Specially Defensive Hippowdon in Team Options.

Tank:
  • Change the set name to Tank, right now it says "Bulky Attacker."
  • Under Team Options, remove Genesect, and restate why Skarmory is a good teammate. Mention some specific Trick Room setters and sweepers.
  • Again, list some Pokemon that take care of Specially Defensive Hippowdon.
Checks and Counters:
  • Change Blissey to Chansey.
Apart from that, the analysis looks good. Fix some of the formatting issues with the top half of the analysis (random blank lines, etc.) and change the title to reflect the new QC system.

QC 2/4

 
Yeah my friend who is good said he thought an agility set would work and if he proves it to me I will write it up or at least test
 

AccidentalGreed

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It's okay, you can write it up without the Agility set. After the analysis gets uploaded, another person can QC Agility Mega Ampharos individually so you don't have to. Another scenario is if your friend proves it before the fourth QC check.
 
Ok I will. And just to be clear I don't wanna seem elitist, if anyone proves to me (with replays) that agility is good I will do it
 

Ash Borer

I've heard they're short of room in hell
Ok I will. And just to be clear I don't wanna seem elitist, if anyone proves to me (with replays) that agility is good I will do it
Agility in the rain works alright, modest at +2 outspeeds Greninja and timid doesnt really get u much, so its Thunder is legitimately powerful
 
I've been using mega amph extensively, almost exclusively, for the past few months, and I've determined that for Mega Ampharos to function well, he needs to be as bulky as possible. His best set is that of a bulky pivot switch, and I think this set needs to be considered:

Ampharos-Mega (M) @ Ampharosite
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 SAtk
Calm Nature
- Thunderbolt/HP Ice/HP Fire
- Dragon Pulse
- Focus Blast
- Volt Switch

This set is exclusively designed to function as a pivot switch, wearing down threats through repeated Volt Switches and safely switching in to another pokemon in waiting. His Special Attack is sky-high and needs little investment, and I would heavily argue that his bulk should be maximized. And at this point, it is rediculously bulky. A damage calc to further prove this:

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mega Ampharos: 307-367 (79.9 - 95.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

On the offensive:

4 SpA Mold Breaker Mega Ampharos Hidden Power Ice vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Landorus: 324-384 (101.2 - 120%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Right. I strongly urge that this set be heavily considered.
 
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I've also used Mega Ampharos as my mega almost exclusively since X/Y release, with the agility set. My preferred EV spread and moves are as follows:
252 Sp Atk/216 Speed/40 HP
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Dragon Pulse
- Focus Blast (alt. coverage HP of your choice)
- Agility

The main purpose of this set is to attempt a midgame sweep and enforce your position by removing or putting a serious hurt on your opponent's key members. With a timid nature, you only need 216 speed EVs (at level 100, you need 212 when at level 50) to outspeed max speed base 130s. The extra points can go into a defensive stat of your choice as from looking at the speed brackets myself, just dumping them into speed will not get you much aside from outspeeding the odd scarfed or +1 base 75ish mon. A fair argument can be made for modest which I understand is the more popular nature to run, but I personally prefer timid for the extra outspeeds it gets.

You need to pick your time to come in carefully if you don't have something around that can make Ampharos' life easier but it can still be done if you know your targets well enough or find yourself with an incidental free turn. For instance, I consider Azumarill a free switch in for Ampharos since unless it's going to hit with CB Play Rough, it's a free setup or dead Azumarill on the next turn. It has enough natural bulk to be able to take a hit prior to the agility, and then it shouldn't have to take much damage after that since you'll outspeed most everything on the field. Personally I use a dual screens Rotom since it affords a lot of extra leeway for setup and lets you tank hits from anything you can't OHKO, like Assault Vest carriers.

Obviously doesn't bust down walls like Blissey or Eviolite Chansey due to its lack of boosting ability, but it's been a mainstay for me for dealing with many powerful offensive and certain defensive threats after a setup.
The way I've described usage of Mega Ampharos to people in the past is that it's not something you just throw on a team because it beats all the competition and is self reliant like some megas are, (read: M-Luke or M-Kang before their bans) but it has its niches and if you want to use it, it's not hard to find a way. It really just appreciates having some form of support to aid the initial setup. Overall I've found agility to be a strong card to be able to play with Ampharos and can't imagine running it on a team WITHOUT that move.

I've also played around with the same set in Trick Room, forcing a switch on the penultimate turn of TR with ampharos, and then using that switch turn to agility, but that's getting too far into a gimmick to be reliable.


I don't play showdown much these days so I haven't any recent replays from there. Might be able to dig some up from my Vs. Recorder with matches against friends however. Watch this space.
 
Yah, I am definitely gonna be writing up the set, just a little busy right now. May even put it first because the voltturn and bulky attacker set aren't the most impressive, although I will see what others say
 

alexwolf

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Posting to support the inclusion of an Agility set, it is a great cleaner that finds many set up chances, resists or is neutral to the most common and stronger priority hits in OU, checks dangerous offensive Pokemon such as Talonflame, Thundurus, Mega Manectric, and Mega Charizard Y, and outruns anything non-Scarfed after a boost that isn't named Deoxys-S, so getting outsped is often not a problem.

Thunder should be slashed after Thunderbolt, as Mega Ampharos is great in rain offense, and the extra power helps OHKO Thundurus without SR, Mega Mawile with SR, CB Scizor with SR, and do stuff like 2HKO max HP Aegislash and SpD Rotom-W.
 

Pyritie

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and outruns anything non-Scarfed after a boost that isn't named Deoxys-S, so getting outsped is often not a problem.
minor nitpick but mega aerodactyl also outspeeds if it's running jolly (max 438 speed vs amph's max 414). He's outsped if he's running adamant though (399)

(same with mega alakazam (also base 150 speed like aero) but he's not very common)
 
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In testing, I've found the agility set to be more trouble than it's worth. If a situation arises where the best option is to Volt Switch out, the boost is gone, and the process must be repeated.

The most solid set is the specially defensive one. It maximizes his usefulness as a pivot switch, and still hits fairly hard. Wish support from a Blob/Sylveon is practically a must, though.
 

Aragorn the King

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In testing, I've found the agility set to be more trouble than it's worth. If a situation arises where the best option is to Volt Switch out, the boost is gone, and the process must be repeated.

The most solid set is the specially defensive one. It maximizes his usefulness as a pivot switch, and still hits fairly hard. Wish support from a Blob/Sylveon is practically a must, though.
Agility really shouldn't be used with Volt Switch. Ampharos can tank, pivot, and sweep. You shouldn't really try to combine it into three/two roles.
 
Agility really shouldn't be used with Volt Switch. Ampharos can tank, pivot, and sweep. You shouldn't really try to combine it into three/two roles.
I guess you're right. I'm probably bringing too much of m. own opinion into this. His stats basically scream "pivot," and using him as anything else just seems odd. I personally dislike the agility set, but clearly it can be used effectively as the replay shows.
 

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