Gen 3 ADV Lead Wailmer [GP 1/1]

[BP]

"TUH HUH HUH, BAD LEAD MATCH UP! LET ME CLAIM 2 MONS"

[SET]
name: Lead
move 1: Water Spout
move 2: Self-Destruct
move 3: Hydro Pump / Surf
move 4: Roar
item: Lum Berry
ability: Water Veil
nature: Hasty
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Wailmer has cemented itself as one of the best leads for offense builds. STAB-boosted Water Spout threatens almost the entirety of ADV ZU, having only a handful of safe answers, such as Staryu, Seaking, and Chinchou. Self-Destruct allows Wailmer to remove any faster Pokemon that cannot OHKO it, such as Staryu and Butterfree, and it also removes Pokemon Water Spout cannot OHKO such as Seaking, Delcatty, and Dustox. When Wailmer is already damaged, Hydro Pump is used to threaten Pokemon that resist Self-Destruct such as Nosepass and Aron. Surf can also be used for its greater accuracy, though it also has lower power and cannot OHKO Nosepass. Roar is used exclusively for opposing Snorunt leads, as they most often use Endure to bait a damaging move to put them into range of their Salac Berry. Alternatively, Snorunt can choose to use Hidden Power Grass, which heavily damages Wailmer rendering Water Spout useless. Lum Berry helps prevent Butterfree putting Wailmer to sleep, allowing Wailmer to remove it with Water Spout.

Wailmer excels on offense teams of almost any variety. It is able to break through opposing leads like Butterfree, Growlithe, and Cyndaquil and common specially defensive Pokemon such as Dustox, Castform, and Delcatty. Other special attackers such as Elekid, Chinchou, and Growlithe greatly appreciate Wailmer softening up or taking down their hard checks and counters, which they normally cannot get through. Alternatively, physical wallbreakers such as Cubone, Aipom, and Pidgeotto can remove specially defensive Pokemon for Wailmer so that it doesn't have to use Self-Destruct to remove them itself. These same physical attackers appreciate the pressure Wailmer applies to Pokemon that resist Normal such as Nosepass, Magnemite, and Shuppet with Water Spout. Ironically, Wailmer pairs well with these Pokemon that resist Normal because Choice Band Aipom OHKOes it with Double Edge. Thunder Wave and Sleep Powder users such as Magnemite, Chinchou, and Butterfree pair well with Wailmer, as they can cripple faster attackers to ensure its safety if it hasn't already used Self-Destruct. Butterfree in particular is worth mentioning, as it is a fantastic mid-game wallbreaker or late-game cleaner that appreciates how much Wailmer threatens Pokemon like Lileep and Dustox. Chinchou is also worth a mention because of its ability to wall other Chinchou and absorb Elekid's Thunderbolt. Bulky attackers such as Castform, Sunflora, and Grimer can threaten both Chinchou and Elekid, which otherwise prove to be major obstacles for Wailmer. Wailmer struggles against other Water-types like Seaking, Staryu, and Croconaw, so Pokemon that can threaten them like Elekid and Bayleef pair well with it.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Ice Beam can be used to reliably beat Lileep one-on-one, but this requires giving up Roar, which forces Wailmer to use an attack on Snorunt. An EV spread of 174 Def / 140 SpA / 132 SpD / 62 Spe and a Modest nature can be used in order to prevent lead Aipom and lead Elekid from OHKOing Wailmer, but this drastically reduces Wailmer's capabilities as an attacker.


Checks and Counters
===================

**Aipom**: Choice Band Aipom can outspeed Wailmer and OHKO it with Double Edge.

**Electric-types**: Elekid and Chinchou can both outspeed Wailmer and OHKO it with Thunderbolt.

**Rock-, Steel-, and Ghost-types**: Pokemon such as Magnemite, Nosepass, and Shuppet can all switch into Wailmer on a Self-Destruct prediction. These Pokemon are only able to switch in on Self-Destruct, as Hydro Pump or Water Spout dispatches them otherwise.

**Lileep and Bayleef**: Lileep and Bayleef are able to survive a Water Spout into a Self-Destruct and, in return, 2HKO Wailmer with their Grass-type STAB moves. While neither can switch into it, they are regarded as the most reliable defensive answers to all of Wailmer's moves, bar Ice Beam.

[SET CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/bp.272450/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/gangsta-spongebob.535530/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/sleid.601970/
Grammar checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/wrathoftheleopard.511181/

 

[Gangsta Spongebob]

Great work, QC 1/2 when implemented

QC 1/2

Add Remove Comment

[SET]
name: Lead
move 1: Water Spout
move 2: Self-Destruct
move 3: Hydro Pump / Surf
move 4: Roar
item: Lum Berry
ability: Water Veil
nature: Hasty
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Wailmer has cemented itself as one of the best leads for offense builds. STAB boosted Water Spout threatens almost the entirety of ADV ZU with only a handful of safe answers. Like? It's better to specify them here and then go over how Self-Destruct beats them Self-Destruct allows Wailmer to remove any faster Pokemon that cannot OHKO it such as Staryu and Butterfree while also removing Pokemon Water Spout cannot OHKO such as Seaking, Delcatty, and Dustox. When Wailmer is already damaged Hydro Pump is used to threaten Pokemon that resist Self-Destruct such as Nosepass and Aron. Surf can also be used for its greater accuracy, though it also has lower power. Does the lower power matter in any notable matchups? State them if so Roar is used almost Is Roar used solely for Snorunt? If so, remove "almost", as even if it does end up being useful in some games for other reasons, the only reason why you're only running it to deal with Snorunt. exclusively for opposing Snorunt leads as they most often use Endure. Go more in detail about this matchup. Explain why Snorunt uses Endure here, and how it's a 50/50 over whether or not Snorunt can get Spikes up Lum Berry helps prevent Wailmer from being put to sleep by Butterfree.

Wailmer excels on offense teams of almost any variety. Physical wallbreakers such as Cubone, Aipom, and Pidgeotto can remove specially defensive Pokemon for Wailmer so that it doesn't have to use Self-Destruct to remove them itself. These same physical attackers appreciates the pressure Wailmer applies to Normal-type resists "Resists" cannot be used as a noun such as Nosepass, Lileep, I would omit Lileep here, it beats Wailmer one-on-one even if it can't switch in when Wailmer is at full health and Shuppet with Water Spout. Thunder Wave and Sleep powder users such as Magnemite, Chinchou, and Butterfree pair well with Wailmer as they can cripple faster attackers to ensure its safety if it hasn't already used Self-Destruct. Butterfree is worth mentioning, as its can act as a fantastic mid- to Mid-game cleaner? I'd use wallbreaker instead. late-game cleaner that appreciates how much Wailmer threatens Pokemon like Lileep and Dustox. Chinchou is also worth a mention due to its ability to wall other Chinchou and absorb Elekid's Thunderbolt. Bulky attackers such as Castform, Sunflora, and Grimer can threaten both Chinchou and Elekid which otherwise prove to be major obstacles for Wailmer. Wailmer struggles against other Water-types like Seaking, Staryu, and Croconaw, so Pokemon that can threaten them like Elekid and Bayleef pair well with it. Elekid also appreciates Wailmer's ability to remove Dustox and Delcatty with Water Spout and Self-Destruct.

Given its nature as an Explosion lead and the fact that it operates on very fast-paced teams, Wailmer should generally be used to deal as much damage to the opponent and not have so much emphasis built on how its teammates can help it wallbreak. I would first state how Wailmer breaks through opposing leads and defensive cores which helps X Pokemon, and then talk about teammates that can help it if it ever finds itself switching out. Don't get me wrong, you talk about both, but you aren't putting as much emphasis on the first scenario, which imo is more important. Also mention Pokemon that can switch into lead CB Aipom, as it forces Wailmer out.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
An EV spread of 174 Def / 140 SpA / 132 SpD / 62 Spe and a Modest nature can be used in order to prevent from being OHKOed by lead Aipom and lead Elekid but this drastically reduces Wailmer's capabilities as an attacker.


Checks and Counters
===================

**Aipom**: Choice Band Aipom can outspeed and OHKO Wailmer with Double Edge.

**Electric-types**: Elekid and Chinchou can both outspeed and OHKO Wailmer with Thunderbolt.

**Normal-type resists Rock-, Steel-, and Ghost-types**: "Resists" cannot be used as a noun Pokemon such as Lileep, Nosepass, and Shuppet can all switch into Wailmer on a Self-Destruct prediction. These Pokemon must be wary of Hydro Pump and Water Spout however. Mention a Steel-type here too. Also emphasize how much Wailmer's Water-type moves destroy many of them.

I would give Lileep its own section, or at least emphasize it. In a one-on-one it 2HKOes with Grass-type STAB and survives Water Spout into Explosion. If Wailer is sufficiently weakened, then it's stonewalled. It isn't perfect, as without Giga Drain Lileep tends to be put in really low health after winning, and it can't switch in, but imo it's the closest thing to a reliable defensive answer to all of Wailmer's moves and it does beat it one-on-one.

[SET CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/bp.272450/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/gangsta-spongebob.535530/

Grammar checked by:

 

[BP]

Implemented and ready for 2nd check. Gangsta Spongebob if the Team Options section is still not what you've envisioned please apply an additional check or contact me.

 

[Zpice]

I remember using this thing from ADV SU, there I'm pretty sure endure salac and rest talk WS Ice Beam were the two main methods. I'm glad it rose to ZU, even if it means I have to replace like 90% of my SU teams lmao

 

[sleid]

Great work here. Was not easy to find flaws here. qc 2/2 when implemented

QC Check

[SET]
name: Lead
move 1: Water Spout
move 2: Self-Destruct
move 3: Hydro Pump / Surf
move 4: Roar
item: Lum Berry
ability: Water Veil
nature: Hasty
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Wailmer has cemented itself as one of the best leads for offense builds. STAB boosted Water Spout threatens almost the entirety of ADV ZU with only a handful of safe answers such as Staryu, Seaking, and Chinchou. Self-Destruct allows Wailmer to remove any faster Pokemon that cannot OHKO it such as Staryu and Butterfree while also removing Pokemon Water Spout cannot OHKO such as Seaking, Delcatty, and Dustox. (does it absolutely need to boom on Delcatty? 252 SpA Wailmer Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Delcatty: 169-199 (49.1 - 57.8%) -- 59% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery. Seems like it can possibly take it down w spout) When Wailmer is already damaged Hydro Pump is used to threaten Pokemon that resist Self-Destruct such as Nosepass and Aron. Surf can also be used for its greater accuracy, though it also has lower power and cannot OHKO Nosepass. Roar is used exclusively for opposing Snorunt leads as they most often use Endure to bait a damaging move to put it into range of its Salac Berry. Alternatively, Snorunt can choose to use Hidden Power Grass which heavily damages Wailmer rendering Water Spout useless. Lum Berry helps prevent Wailmer from being put to sleep by Butterfree allowing it to remove it with Water Spout.

Wailmer excels on offense teams of almost any variety. Wailmer is able to break through opposing leads like Butterfree, Growlithe and Cyndaquil, and common specially defensive Pokemon such as Dustox, Castform, Delcatty. Other special attackers such as Elekid, Chinchou, and Growlithe greatly appreciate this. (maybe add something at the end here like "greatly appreciate Wailmer softening up or taking down their hard checks/counters that they normally cannot get through") Alternatively, physical wallbreakers such as Cubone, Aipom, and Pidgeotto can remove specially defensive Pokemon for Wailmer so that it doesn't have to use Self-Destruct to remove them itself. These same physical attackers appreciate the pressure Wailmer applies to Pokemon that resist Normal-types such as Nosepass, Magnemite, and Shuppet with Water Spout. Ironically, Wailmer pairs well with these Pokemon that resist Normal-types due to Choice Band Aipom OHKOing it with Double Edge. Thunder Wave and Sleep powder users such as Magnemite, Chinchou, and Butterfree pair well with Wailmer as they can cripple faster attackers to ensure its safety if it hasn't already used Self-Destruct. Butterfree is worth mentioning, as its can act as a fantastic mid-game wallbreaker or late-game cleaner that appreciates how much Wailmer threatens Pokemon like Lileep and Dustox. Chinchou is also worth a mention due to its ability to wall other Chinchou and absorb Elekid's Thunderbolt. Bulky attackers such as Castform, Sunflora, and Grimer can threaten both Chinchou and Elekid which otherwise prove to be major obstacles for Wailmer. Wailmer struggles against other Water-types like Seaking, Staryu, and Croconaw, so Pokemon that can threaten them like Elekid and Bayleef pair well with it. Elekid also appreciates Wailmer's ability to remove Dustox and Delcatty with Water Spout and Self-Destruct. You already mention this last part in the 3rd sentence of this paragraph.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============
Ice Beam can be used to reliably beat Lileep one-on-one but this requires giving up Roar which forces Wailmer to use an attacking on Snorunt. An EV spread of 174 Def / 140 SpA / 132 SpD / 62 Spe and a Modest nature can be used in order to prevent from being OHKOed by lead Aipom and lead Elekid but this drastically reduces Wailmer's capabilities as an attacker.


Checks and Counters
===================

**Aipom**: Choice Band Aipom can outspeed and OHKO Wailmer with Double Edge.

**Electric-types**: Elekid and Chinchou can both outspeed and OHKO Wailmer with Thunderbolt.

**Rock- Steel- and Ghost-types**: Pokemon such as Magnemite, Nosepass, and Shuppet can all switch into Wailmer on a Self-Destruct prediction. These Pokemon are only able to switch in on Self-Destruct, as they are otherwise dispatched by Hydro Pump or Water Spout.

**Lileep**: On a one-on-one, Lileep is able to survive a Water Spout into an Explosion while in return 2HKOing Wailmer with its Grass-type STAB. While Lileep cannot switch in it is regarded as one of the most reliable defensive answers to all of Wailmer's moves, bar Ice Beam.

I think Bayleef is worth mentioning somewhere in here, as it can live Water Spout + Self Destruct.

[SET CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/bp.272450/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/gangsta-spongebob.535530/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/sleid.601970/
Grammar checked by:

 

[BP]

This is done and ready for GP! GP Team

 

[Rose]

add remove comment

BP, post: 9752513, member: 272450

[SET]
name: Lead
move 1: Water Spout
move 2: Self-Destruct
move 3: Hydro Pump / Surf
move 4: Roar
item: Lum Berry
ability: Water Veil
nature: Hasty
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Wailmer has cemented itself as one of the best leads for offense builds. STAB boosted STAB-boosted Water Spout threatens almost the entirety of ADV ZU, (comma) with having only a handful of safe answers, (comma) such as Staryu, Seaking, and Chinchou. Self-Destruct allows Wailmer to remove any faster Pokemon that cannot OHKO it, (comma) such as Staryu and Butterfree, (comma) while also removing and it also removes Pokemon Water Spout cannot OHKO such as Seaking, Delcatty, and Dustox. When Wailmer is already damaged, (comma) Hydro Pump is used to threaten Pokemon that resist Self-Destruct such as Nosepass and Aron. Surf can also be used for its greater accuracy, though it also has lower power and cannot OHKO Nosepass. Roar is used exclusively for opposing Snorunt leads, (comma) as they most often use Endure to bait a damaging move to put it them into range of its their Salac Berry. Alternatively, Snorunt can choose to use Hidden Power Grass, (comma) which heavily damages Wailmer, (comma) rendering Water Spout useless. Lum Berry helps prevent Wailmer from being put to sleep by Butterfree Butterfree putting Wailmer to sleep, allowing it Wailmer to remove it with Water Spout.

Wailmer excels on offense teams of almost any variety. Wailmer It is able to break through opposing leads like Butterfree, Growlithe, (comma) and Cyndaquil, (comma) and common specially defensive Pokemon such as Dustox, Castform, and Delcatty. Other special attackers such as Elekid, Chinchou, and Growlithe greatly appreciate Wailmer softening up or taking down their hard checks/counters that checks and counters, which they normally cannot get through. Alternatively, physical wallbreakers such as Cubone, Aipom, and Pidgeotto can remove specially defensive Pokemon for Wailmer so that it doesn't have to use Self-Destruct to remove them itself. These same physical attackers appreciate the pressure Wailmer applies to Pokemon that resist Normal-types Normal such as Nosepass, Magnemite, and Shuppet with Water Spout. Ironically, Wailmer pairs well with these Pokemon that resist Normal-types due to Normal because Choice Band Aipom OHKOing OHKOes it with Double Edge. Thunder Wave and Sleep powder Powder users such as Magnemite, Chinchou, and Butterfreepair well with Wailmer, (comma) as they can cripple faster attackers to ensure its safety if it hasn't already used Self-Destruct. Butterfree in particular is worth mentioning, as its can act as it is a fantastic mid-game wallbreaker or late-game cleaner that appreciates how much Wailmer threatens Pokemon like Lileep and Dustox. Chinchou is also worth a mention due to because of its ability to wall other Chinchou and absorb Elekid's Thunderbolt. Bulky attackers such as Castform, Sunflora, and Grimer can threaten both Chinchou and Elekid, (comma) which otherwise prove to be major obstacles for Wailmer. Wailmer struggles against other Water-types like Seaking, Staryu, and Croconaw, so Pokemon that can threaten them like Elekid and Bayleef pair well with it.

[STRATEGY COMMENTS] (fixed indents)
Other Options
=============

Ice Beam can be used to reliably beat Lileep one-on-one, (comma) but this requires giving up Roar, (comma) which forces Wailmer to use an attacking attack on Snorunt. An EV spread of 174 Def / 140 SpA / 132 SpD / 62 Spe and a Modest nature can be used in order to prevent from being OHKOed by lead Aipom and lead Elekid lead Aipom and lead Elekid from OHKOing Wailmer, but this drastically reduces Wailmer's capabilities as an attacker.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Aipom**: Choice Band Aipom can outspeed Wailmer and OHKO Wailmer it with Double Edge.

**Electric-types**: Elekid and Chinchou can both outspeed Wailmer and OHKO Wailmer it with Thunderbolt.

**Rock-, (comma) Steel-, (comma) and Ghost-types**: Pokemon such as Magnemite, Nosepass, and Shuppet can all switch into Wailmer on a Self-Destruct prediction. These Pokemon are only able to switch in on Self-Destruct, as they are otherwise dispatched by Hydro Pump or Water Spout dispatches them otherwise.

**Lileep and Bayleef**: On a one-on-one, Lileep and Bayleef are able to survive a Water Spout into a Self-Destruct while in return 2HKOing and, in return, 2HKO Wailmer with their Grass-type STAB moves. While neither cannot can switch in into it, they are regarded as the most reliable defensive answers to all of Wailmer's moves, bar Ice Beam.

[SET CREDITS]
Written by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/bp.272450/
Quality checked by:
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/gangsta-spongebob.535530/
https://www.smogon.com/forums/members/sleid.601970/
Grammar checked by:

GP Team done

 

[BP]

This is done and ready for upload