Offline Battle Tower teams

[DougJustDoug]

Well one thing That I get lucky with is the fact that I NEVER ONCE got one of those OHKO moves to actually work on me.

Quite often that has happened to me.
What I notice is that MOST, if not ALL pokemon the AI uses in the battle tower is easily OHKO'd by a pokemon with around 195+ attack, and is meant for physical attacking.
Whats why my team is primary Defensive. Machamp takes care of things that would normally wall me. Even if I do get walled, I have The 100% chance of confusion and the Sleep combo with Machamp and Spiritomb.

All I need is a new item for Spiritomb

OHKO moves are by far the worst part of the battle tower. Quick claws are second, IMO. Next is probably untimely crits, but those seem to go both ways for me. I got my 165 wins with Jumpman's team. The great thing about that team, is that it has a good chance to recover from hax. I've had other teams that were better in a "fair fight", but if one pokemon dies to hax, the rest of the team can't function well. Jumpman's team is remarkable in the ability for each team member to "take up the slack" when inevitable hax occurs. Ultimately, my best streak was ended by several consecutive hax, but it started with a huge OHKO Fissure from a Dugtrio.

Your team looks pretty damn good to me. It's not obvious that it would do well in the BT. If you posted it as a prospective team, I would have advised against using it. But now that I analyze the parts, I can see why you've done so well. I do imagine you need quite a bit of patience to use defensive play when Machamp needs to switch out. I've had similar experience when using Milotic and Blissey on some of my teams. Boring in many cases, but eerily effective in the tower.

I hadn't noticed the BT weakness to 195+ physical attacking pokes. But, now that you mention it, I may test it out.

 

[kingofgames]

:) Go and test everything from my observations out.
Things that will change the results is (of course) intimidate.

The reason why Stone Edge and Thunder Punch are on the same set is to deal with either Gyarados or other Flying types. Theres one thing to make a set, that looks good with the standard with the rest of the community, but when actually dealing with specific situations, I know what to expect. Most of the time, Dynamicpunch is the move I use to start out with.

Stone edge will take care of most Flying Types, while Thunder Punch will make a great dent in Gyarados.

The once reason why I use Machamp over Weavile is the fact Machamp can take hits better, and I love Machamp.

Its true that it takes alot of time (I'm talking OVER 30 minutes with alot of Cresselia / Spiritomb Stalling) but while in the process, I can tell what the computer is going to do.

What made me notice the Physical Weakness is when I tried to use My 200 Special Atk. Porygon Z against a specific pokemon, mainly those fighting types.

They have more Special Defense than Defence, but with the slightly higher Special Attack, I figured that I can still take them down in one hit.

Also, most pokemon I've faced in the Battle Tower over 100 speed isnt that high. My Machamp has 106 Speed + 53 (From Choice Scarf) And he goes first 90% of the time. The other 10% is from pokemon like Jolteon, or SOMETIMES Garchomp.

If I know the AI is packing one of those Resist Berries, I'll wear it down with one of Spiritomb's moves, then switch in for the Super-effective kill.
I cant count the amount of times those berries screwed me over.

As a side note: around Battles 22-49, Special Attacking works well.
I used Gallade in place of Machamp, and Porygon-Z in place of Spiritomb, knowing I would have to fight a cresselia on the 49th battle.
Porygon-Z's Tri-Attack + Silk Scarf does wonders to most of those pokemon in the battle tower.
Dont worry about the Choice Scarf on him, as moving first isnt Porygon's worry in the BT, its surviving an attack.

That was my approach to the BT. Trying to survive atleast one attack. My second was Moderate Speed pokemon.

 

[Jumpman16]

Regardless of you team that last line says almost all I need to hear, trying to survive at least one attack. That is why I will not use LO on Starmie and advise against doing so to those who are copying my team, since, again, there are myriad Normal pokemon that Starmie is not OHKOing with LO but that cant do at least 70% to Starmie (and if they do 80%+ Starmie will OHKO itself trying to kill the first pokemon instead of only being alive for two pokemon max).

Machamp is deliciously bulky and I am considering using it on a future BT team because of No Guard and the fact that it can hit 11 types for SE with that set. Speaking of your emphasis of "Moderate Speed Pokemon"...Cress and especially Spiritomb are pretty slow especially with 0 SpD EVs lol so I don't know where you're getting that. I'd use Wide Lens to help Spiritomb's Hypnosis if anything.

 

[kingofgames]

Jump: By Moderate speed, I'm talking about battle tower standards .

The only reason why I dont use Breloom over Machamp is because he cant take a good hit well.

His Special Defenses are low, and his main weakness is Flying, and just about EVERY pokemon the AI uses knows Aerial Ace.

 

[DarkDestruction]

What would you consider "Moderate Speed?" What Base Speed and what actual Speed?

 

[kingofgames]

that Depends on What the pokemon is.

Moderately, I say 65-90
For Machamp, his ability makes up for his lack of speed.

Base speed will not explain what I'm trying to say: Looking at my pokemon's speed, 85-110 will do for me in the battle tower.

Normally, Starmie would be well in the Battle, but due to the amount of weaknesses and how she doesnt always OHKO Pokemon, she may not be able to take a hit. Same thing with Porygon Z

 

[ikke]

i used this for speed runs to get bp:
lost count and got to 34

Never thought about it as a team having no walls etc.

starmie @ life orb orb
modest nature
255satk/255spe

psycic
surf
ice beam
thunder bolt

basic poke here, got me threw the first 3 rounds fine
with the other 2 just as back up.
and for the champ:
-surf/ice beam on rhyperior 1Hko
-ice beam on nite 1HKO
-tbolt 1HKO/2HKO milotic

garchomp
adamant nature
255at/255 spe

fire fang
earthquake
dragon claw
crunhc

gengar
timid nature
252satk/252spe/4hp

focus blast
energy ball
thunder bolt
shadow ball

 

[DarkDestruction]

Do you have items for Gengar and Garchomp? You also know that Weavile could tear your team up, right? Not exactly the best idea having a team that can be torn up by just one Pokémon, especially one of the fastest in the Battle Tower, but we can fix that.

 

[kingofgames]

Weavile isnt encountered that often in the battle tower. All he needs to do is switch in and out when he sees a weavile.

 

[Jumpman16]

Switch in and out to what? This:

848 Weavile Jolly Focus Sash Night Slash Ice Punch Aerial Ace Brick Break Atk/Speed

beats him literally every time, even if his Garchomp has a Scarf. He can't keep switching Garchomp into Night Slashes meant for Starmie or Gengar, or switching Starmie into Ice Punches. Weavile is faster and can OHKO everything on his team barring Sash/Brightpowder of his own.

"isnt encountered that often in the battle tower" isn't really the best way of dealing with problem pokemon, because besides the fact that this:

800 Froslass Timid Expert Belt Ice Beam Shadow Ball Thunderbolt Destiny Bond Sp. Atk/Speed

also can murder him unless Garchomp has a Sash or Gengar wins the coinflip, you should be very wary when there is one pokemon that can sweep your entire team. A second team I'm working on had a lone problem of that 800 Froslass and I twweaked my team just to ensure it can't beat me without supreme hax, and coincidentally I posted earlier in this thread how my current team deals with Weavile, its biggest problem and perhaps only single pokemon my entire team doesn't like facing.

 

[kingofgames]

Well running a highly defensive team will allow you to survive a hit.
Fearing Weavile is what makes trainers Fail. I dont fear weavile. I laugh at it, how pitiful its defenses are.

Next: What does those Numbers mean? 800 and 848

Froslass is a problem, since I just ran into 3 of them on my last Battle Tower run, and I was trying to figure out what set it was using

The Destiny Bond, the Physical or the Special Set.

Turns out to be the Special Set. My spiritomb's Dark Pulse Took care of her easily. And Since (oddly enough) My machamp outsped a Weavile in the Battle Tower, I had no worry, and took him down with ease

 

[Jumpman16]

ok lol first of all, my post wasnt directed at your team, it was directed at his, so I'm not sure why most of your post is telling me how your team does against Weavile and Froslass like it's something to be overly proud of, lol. "Fearing Weavile is what makes trainers Fail"? Come on. If you used the team he posted you would either be afraid of it or defiant, but still a loser of the battle at the end of the day if you face the one I referenced. He has a problem with it that isn't solved by just "switching in and out of it" like with your team, I'm sure you can realize that if you reread my post.

Second, I am copy/pasting from here, which, coupled with your surprise that your Machamp once outran a Weavile (without looking it was the brave metal claw one), leads me to believe that you're actually not scouting a database for what movesets the pokes you're facing have. If that's true, you've been more fortunate than I originally thought—several people here have closely consulted with that database and not broken 100. I suggest you start using that asap.

 

[kingofgames]

I'm not scouting databases for movesets

Its what I expect out of the battle tower.
If Its what I expect,then my team should do well.

That previous post by by wasnt directed to you Jump

Only the 800 and 848 was directed to you.

The only think I look at is Pokemon Weaknesses (For data). I dont do that damage calculator or anything. This is my first Pokemon Game since Crystal, and so far, the Battle Tower is a Bit of a letdown, since GSC was more challenging.

 

[Jumpman16]

Ok, suit yourself. You asked " Someone want to try and help me?" and I'm trying to help. Many would argue that the moveset database is the #1 most helpful thing at a trainer's disposal when he or she is taking on the Battle Tower. I'm not going to tell you which pokemon particularly give you trouble if you don't especially want to know—I will tell you that if you end up losing it will likely be more because you were surprised at a particular moveset than being "outplayed" by the AI.

 

[ikke]

Do you have items for Gengar and Garchomp? You also know that Weavile could tear your team up, right? Not exactly the best idea having a team that can be torn up by just one Pokémon, especially one of the fastest in the Battle Tower, but we can fix that.

I know but it was meant for speed runs to get a lot of bp first
then i tried further

I think weaville DID rape it xD

garchomp: lum berry/gengar nothing

 

[kingofgames]

jump: you took that the wrong way.

When I said "I'm not scouting databases for movesets"
I was agreeing with your statement in the previous post

I'll probably scout them now, but They arent all the movesets.

I've seen different ones

 

[Jumpman16]

Oh ok, yeah what you said could be interpreted either way but your second paragraph had me thinking you wanted to "play it fair" or something. Anyway which different movesets do you think you've seen? I have yet to be surprised by anything in the BT, except for that fact that a 0 Spe EVs Miltank outsped my Jolly 252 Spe EVs Tyranitar (at Lv100 Miltank loses 236 to 243 but it's like 134 to 123 at Lv50, how lame).

 

[kingofgames]

Sorry about that confusion
Well I was checking that list, and they have all the movesets that I've encountered so far (with froslass) but The moveset was slightly combined.

Destiny Bond
Blizzard
Attract
Crunch

I'm pretty sure it was that, because he almost Sixty-Four'd my Spiritomb with that.
If it wasnt, then I got it mixed up

 

[DiamondDust]

i think i might try a team with..
rattata @ focus sash (everything else doesnt matter =/)
-endeavor
-quick attack
-filler
-filler

phanapy @ focus sash
-endeavor
-ice shard
-filler
-filler

donphan @ focus sash
-ice shard
-endeavor
-filler
-filler

what wouldnt work about this? since nobody is smart enough to switch out XD.
i have almost never used the battle tower, so i dunno if this would work or not.

 

[Adamant_Torterra]

i think i might try a team with..
rattata @ focus sash (everything else doesnt matter =/)
-endeavor
-quick attack
-filler
-filler

phanapy @ focus sash
-endeavor
-ice shard
-filler
-filler

donphan @ focus sash
-ice shard
-endeavor
-filler
-filler

what wouldnt work about this? since nobody is smart enough to switch out XD.
i have almost never used the battle tower, so i dunno if this would work or not.

Leftovers kills it.

 

[DarkDestruction]

i think i might try a team with..
rattata @ focus sash (everything else doesnt matter =/)
-endeavor
-quick attack
-filler
-filler

phanapy @ focus sash
-endeavor
-ice shard
-filler
-filler

donphan @ focus sash
-ice shard
-endeavor
-filler
-filler

what wouldnt work about this? since nobody is smart enough to switch out XD.
i have almost never used the battle tower, so i dunno if this would work or not.

It won't. There are a few problems here. First, your Pokémon must have UNIQUE items, meaning NO TRIPLE FOCUS SASH!!! Second, as someone already mentioned, your team is dead to Leftovers. Third, even if you could use this team, all different Quick Attacks would kill you. Fourth, Hail / Snow Warning (Abomasnow) kills your team, and Sandstorm / Sand Stream both kill Rattata. Fifth, and someone correct me on this if I'm wrong, Ghost types are immune to Endeavor.

*********
In other news, I went back to the Battle Tower with my Lucario, Mesprit, and Gyarados (look on the last page for their sets and EV spreads). I'm up to 35 right now, but I plan on doubling or tripling that tonight.

 

[DarkDestruction]

I got screwed over something nasty in the Battle Tower.

Battle 45
My Team: Lucario, Mesprit, and Gyarados (refer to previous page for moves and EV spreads)

Opponent's team:

794 Electrode Adamant Focus Sash Magnet Rise Gyro Ball Screech Explosion Atk/Def
663 Typhlosion Timid White Herb Overheat Eruption Focus Blast Sunny Day Sp. Atk/Speed
788 Manectric Brightpowder Thunderbolt Flamethrower Thunder Wave Captivate Sp. Atk/Speed

Battle opens with Electrode and Lucario. Electrode uses Gyro Ball for almost no damage. Lucario uses Swords Dance (I suspected a Magnet Rise, but okay).

Electrode uses Gyro Ball for, again, almost nothing. Lucario uses Close Combat. Electrode hung on with its Focus Sash. (Here, I should've used another Swords Dance, as you'll see next.)

Lucario uses ExtremeSpeed. Electrode is down. Out comes Typhlosion.

Lucario uses ExtremeSpeed. Typhlosion has ~3-5% HP left (almost nothing). Typhlosion uses Overheat. Lucario is down. White Herb restores Typhlosion's stats to normal. (Not a problem. I can deal with that.) I send out Gyarados. Intimidate activates.

Typhlosion uses Eruption, inflicting very little damage (little enough to recover back to full HP with Leftovers). Gyarados uses Waterfall. Typhlosion is down. (Should've used a Dragon Dance here, fearing a STABed Overheat with Blaze in effect, but found out later that that Overheat wouldn't have done more than 55-60% damage to Gyarados. Oh well.) Gyarados restores HP with Leftovers. Out comes Manectric.

Now begins my royal screwing. I leave Gyarados in knowing that Manectric is much faster without a DD, and that any Electric attack it uses is death to Gyarados.

Manectric uses Thunderbolt. Gyarados is gone. I send in Mesprit. (Warning: bull[Censored by the FCC] ahead! Watch your step!)

Manectric uses Thunderbolt. A Critical Hit! (13/156 HP left on Mesprit) Mesprit is paralyzed! Mesprit uses Psychic. Mesprit's attack missed! Manectric uses Flamethrower for game.

Let's take a look at that last exchange. Critical hit chance is what - 12.5%? Someone correct me if I'm wrong. Paralysis on Thunderbolt is 10%, and Brightpowder working is also what, 10%? Let's see what the chances are of all three happening at once.

12.5% * 10% * 10% = 0.00125, a 0.125% chance, 1 in 800.

Had none of that happened, Psychic would've been an easy 2HKO on Manectric (barring Critical Hits, of course [looks at the one I got hit by]), and I could've kept going.

Now that I've had my 1 in 800, my next 799 should go very smoothly. Once again, someone please correct me on my numbers if I'm wrong.

 

[Poliwaggle]

Will someone please give some suggestions on how to make my teams not suck?

Gyarados @Life Orb
Adamant
72 HP/252 Atk/184 Spe
Waterfall
Earthquake
Ice Fang
Dragon Dance

Magnezone @Leftovers
Modest
Magnet Pull
172 HP/ 252 SpAtk/84 Spe
Thunderbolt
Flash Cannon
Substitute
Magnet Rise

Bronzong @Macho Brace
Brave
Levitate
252 HP/152 Atk/8 Def/96 SpDef
Gyro Ball
Earthquake
Light Screen
Hypnosis

Weavile @Focus Sash
Jolly
252 Atk/252 Spe/6 HP
Swords Dance
Brick Break
Night Slash
Ice Shard

Lucario @Choice Specs
252 SpAtk/252 Spe/6 HP
Modest
Steadfast
Vacuum Wave
Dragon Pulse
Dark Pulse
Aura Sphere

Slowbro @Leftovers
Bold
Own Tempo
212 HP/252 Def/12 Spe/34 SpDef
Psychic
Surf
Calm Mind
Slack Off

 

[blastoiselover100]

I am currently using:

Uxie@ Leftovers
Bold
252 Hp/128 def/128 sdef
~Psychic
~Thunderbolt
~Rest
~Sleep Talk

Garchomp@ Muscle Band
Adamant
252 Atk/252 spd
~Dragon Claw
~EQ
~Sub
~Flamethrower

Gengar@ Wise Glasses
Modest
252 Satk/252 Spd
~Thunderbolt
~Shadow Ball
~Energy Ball
~Explosion

I am thinking of replacing Garchomp for DD Gyarados. Should I do that or just keep it the same?

 

[Poliwaggle]

At the moment you have a 4x Ice weakness and no resistances, if you get a Gyarados you will have a 4x electric weakness and no resists so either way it's mostly the same. I would personally say use the DD Gyarados as I use him and is amazing.